The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

[c1ue]

Re: The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

I didn't know that Japan was threatenedy by China in the 1930's.

Japan and China have had an adversarial relationship for literally thousands of years.

The term Kamikaze in fact arose from a typhoon sinking a Chinese invasion fleet.

It was only after the Meiji Restoration that Japan was in a position to repay its centuries of being bullied by China.

It was supposed to be a peaceful way of containing this belligerent nation.

I recommend you read up on the history more. In fact Japan had signed commercial agreements to buy literally millions of barrels of US oil and oil products; these were all either unilaterally abrogated or held up by deliberate US internal bureaucracy.

It was this act which the scholars agree - on both sides of the Pacific - which prompted Japan's leadership to consider other actions. In fact it was this act which allowed the militant faction within Japanese politics to gain ascendancy.

There is no question Japan was belligerent, but that isn't the issue. In the same period, Germany was belligerent but didn't undergo any embargoes.

In fact there were far more provocations than the oil embargo.

The Flying Tigers, for example, was a cadre of US pilots and airplanes supplied to China to fight the Japanese 6 months before Pearl Harbor.

Germany and the Soviet Union both also supplied Chiang Kai Shek in order to 'contain' Japan.

The collective refusal of a nation to economically cooperate or assist or help another nation is not an attack and is certainly not an act of war.

If your nation is 80% dependent on oil imports, and your largest supplier just canceled all its previously signed agreements with you to supply oil, do you consider this an act of peace?

And what if said supplier also sent its military aircraft and pilots specifically to fight your forces?

[jk]

Re: The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

The collective refusal of a nation to economically cooperate or assist or help another nation is not an attack and is certainly not an act of war.

i believe there was a blockade of others' commerce involved.

[Scot]

Re: The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

Sanctions are ALWAYS an act of war. Only an act of Orwellian redefinition can change that reality.

The collective refusal of a nation to economically cooperate or assist or help another nation is not an attack and is certainly not an act of war.

[Slimprofits]

Re: The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

Sanctions are ALWAYS an act of war. Only an act of Orwellian redefinition can change that reality.

[Polish_Silver]

Re: The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

I didn't know that Japan was threatenedy by China in the 1930's. Have to read up on that.
However, the economic sanctions against Japan were supposedly because of thier growing empire
in the far east. It was supposed to be a peaceful way of containing this belligerent nation.
The US should have expected a military response, and the Pearl Harbor defenses were badly
mismanaged.

[c1ue]

Re: The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

Ah yes, more of the "nobody is truly in control of their own actions" type of memes.

What exactly are you trying to say?

I've never said Japan was right in attacking Pearl Harbor; what I said above is that there were clear logical reasons why Japan did so, and prominent among them was economic provocation/warfare by the United States and UK.

To go from that to "it isn't Japan's fault" is just as ludicrous as saying "Japan was wrong in attacking China in 1936" but ignoring the literal waves of attempts by mainland China to attack Japan.

[Ghent12]

Re: The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

We've already talked about this.

It had a little to do with Japan, and a lot to do with British and American economic warfare.

The rest was just a result of operations.

Ah yes, more of the "nobody is truly in control of their own actions" type of memes.

[Slimprofits]

Re: How can banks take the hit? --It's not thier money!

front page of the Sunday Boston Globe:

http://www.boston.com/business/artic...ly_get_poorer/

While family incomes across Massachusetts have generally risen over the past three decades, the state’s poorest residents have fallen behind. And nowhere have they fallen farther than here in Western Massachusetts, where families in the bottom fifth of the income scale have seen inflation-adjusted earnings drop below 1979 levels, according to a new study by University of Massachusetts economists.

[..]

For example, the inflation-adjusted median income of affluent families in Greater Boston has grown 54 percent since 1979, to $230,000 from $150,000 a year, largely due to high-paying technology jobs.

In Berkshire County and the Pioneer Valley, where decades of plant closings have left hollowed-out economies, the inflation-adjusted median income of the poorest families fell 24 percent, from $21,000 a year in 1979 to $16,000 - on par with some of the most impoverished parts of Appalachia.

[c1ue]

Re: The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

Why did Japan invade Pearl Harbor?

We've already talked about this.

It had a little to do with Japan, and a lot to do with British and American economic warfare.

The rest was just a result of operations.

[touchring]

Re: The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

In case you didn't know - there is no question that all those women-less, boy baby bulge youngsters in China don't have any fear of confrontation with the West.

The question has always been: will they be contained by the oldsters on top? Can they?

People can be brain washed easily by politicians to feel the sense invincibility. Why did Japan invade Pearl Harbor? Why would anyone perform kamikaze. Megalomania can be contagious.

Often the one's greatest enemy is oneself. That's why I always believe that authoritarianism will ultimately lead to the path of self-destruction. Regardless of how well one does at the beginning, the final result is destruction.

Satan is very real. Satan will lure you with success, money and glory at the start, but eventually will devour your soul and your very lives.

[c1ue]

Re: The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

In case you didn't know - there is no question that all those women-less, boy baby bulge youngsters in China don't have any fear of confrontation with the West.

The question has always been: will they be contained by the oldsters on top? Can they?

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basketb...n=ncaab-wp4252

Follow Yahoo! Sports on Facebook and be the first to know about the most interesting stories of the day.
At the same time as Vice President Joe Biden is visiting Beijing in hopes of improving relations between the U.S. and China, another group on a goodwill trip from Washington encountered an unexpected diplomatic hiccup.


Georgetown had to leave the court during the fourth quarter of its exhibition game against the Bayi Rockets on Thursday night in Beijing after both benches emptied and a wild brawl erupted between the two teams. None of the Hoyas was seriously injured despite trading punches with the opposing players and having to dodge chairs thrown onto the court and water bottles hurled from the stands.

The best account of what led to the melee comes from the Washington Post's Gene Wang, apparently the lone U.S. reporter in attendance.

Wang wrote that the game was tense from the outset and had to be stopped earlier after two players exchanged words. At one point, a Rockets player even berated John Thompson III as the Georgetown coach yelled instructions to his players.

The hard fouls and constant bickering eventually devolved into bedlam when Bayi big man Hu Ke was called for a foul against Georgetown guard Jason Clark. The senior made it clear he did not appreciate the hard foul, sparking the initial exchange of shoves that led players from both benches to run onto the court in defense of their teammates.

Video of the melee is available at the bottom of this post and this photo gallery from Sina.com also offers several more scenes of the chaos. It was bad enough that Georgetown coach John Thompson III yanked his team off the court, made a hasty exit out of the arena with the score tied at 64 and then issued the following statement about the incident soon afterward.

"Tonight, two great teams played a very competitive game that unfortunately ended after heated exchanges with both teams," Thompson said. "We sincerely regret that this situation occurred. We remain grateful for the opportunity our student athletes are having to engage in a sport they love here in China, while strengthening their understanding of a nation we respect and admire at Georgetown University."

It's unclear whether Georgetown will continue its 11-day exhibition tour of China or not, but the Hoyas certainly have had a memorable trip so far.

Wednesday's impromptu visit with Biden once seemed like the most exciting part of the trip. Now that's a distant second.

[lakedaemonian]

Re: The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

It depends on which side you're on. If you are an Afghan freedom fighter, you'll be in an even more horrific position than a WWI soldier. Or well, maybe less since the firepower from an Apache or Predator makes a relatively quick death.

This would be an example of where cross pollination with other forums and respected SMEs might prove enlightening.

[touchring]

Re: The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

All those troops were drawn into the most horrific situation, way beyond anything a soldier has to endure today. Imagine watching 20,000 others dead right before your eyes and yet no option but to follow? Madness. Eventually, even the Generals were brought to realise their stupidity; but not until millions had been slaughtered. Utter Madness.

It depends on which side you're on. If you are an Afghan freedom fighter, you'll be in an even more horrific position than a WWI soldier. Or well, maybe less since the firepower from an Apache or Predator makes a relatively quick death.

[Chris Coles]

Re: The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

I'm still amazed that in WWI countries could get young men to subject themselves to such conditions. Trench warfare has to be about as bad as it gets. I just watched a documentary on Gallipoli, and I think it said that at any one time about 2/3 of the men had dysentery. Then throw in lack of decent food and water, broiling heat, freezing cold, the stench of thousands of dead bodies, and of course the idiot uncaring commanders. Yet for the most part, the British maintained discipline throughout the war. Amazing.

You need to think through the full situation of those troops. They had been placed on a ship, dropped off after a long voyage onto a shore with NO facilities whatever and then add that the slightest chance that ANY ONE of them were going to try and walk off; the individual would be shot as a deserter .... and, in any case, where were they going to go? No ship behind them, hostile Turks in front.

The same for WW1. if they did not go over the top they were to be branded as a coward. My own father went through that when, on an early flight, one of the connecting rods on his aircraft engine broke with it sticking out of the engine and the engine sounding like it was going to totally seize up, so he turned back to the airfield and was summarily arrested for cowardice and only got away with it when they could see he was telling the truth. If his engine had not been visibly damaged, I would not be here today as he would have been shot on the spot.

All those troops were drawn into the most horrific situation, way beyond anything a soldier has to endure today. Imagine watching 20,000 others dead right before your eyes and yet no option but to follow? Madness. Eventually, even the Generals were brought to realise their stupidity; but not until millions had been slaughtered. Utter Madness.

[Ghent12]

Re: The Next Ten Years – Part I: There will be blood - Eric Janszen

I'm still amazed that in WWI countries could get young men to subject themselves to such conditions. Trench warfare has to be about as bad as it gets. I just watched a documentary on Gallipoli, and I think it said that at any one time about 2/3 of the men had dysentery. Then throw in lack of decent food and water, broiling heat, freezing cold, the stench of thousands of dead bodies, and of course the idiot uncaring commanders. Yet for the most part, the British maintained discipline throughout the war. Amazing.

War changes things considerably in the minds and bodies of its participants. I read the book "House to House" by David Bellavia which was about the most recent Iraq conflict and specifically about urban warfare inside Fallujah. It described how everyone he fought alongside and he had soiled themselves out of necessity. I think my paraphrasing isn't doing it justice--it's a good read to get an idea of the visceral nature of modern warfare.