Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

[Woodsman]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

Someone did. At least the (not so) secret part about how a president, convinced by his personal experience in war and guided by the counsel of such men as the former General of the Army and the future dean of the Fletcher School of Law and Diplomacy, fought to keep his country and his people out of a disastrous war.

No book has done more to change the view of scholars and academics on the subject of American involvement in Vietnam than Prof. John Newman’s JFK and Vietnam. I don't think you'll find a better one.

For reasons they've been unwilling to share, Dr. Newman has not been invited to speak at conference sponsored by the Vietnam Center and Archive out of Texas Tech at the National Archives in late September. I find it interesting because a look at the speaker's list will note that many of the other invited scholars have yet to produce a work of such magnitude.

I've emailed Prof. Steve Maxner, director of the Vietnam Center and Archive, Texas Tech University to ask respectfully that he work to correct this oversight. Any interested persons out there might do the same if a spare moment makes itself available.

[Thailandnotes]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

https://lareviewofbooks.org/review/a...l-american-war

[reggie]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

pls write 'the secret history of the vietnam war'.

btw... what do you think of kissinger?

vietnam war = one of the principle levers in getting the Chinese elite to the Globalist's "table"

kissinger = one of the instrumental actors in opening up China to the Globalists, in preparation fo Clinton's 1990's GATT, which sealed the deal.

[metalman]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

They got that covered, reggie:

http://www.vietnamwar50th.com/

It's a 13 year effort to propagandize us into thinking just that. Here's the President at the kick off:

"Because of Vietnam and our veterans, we now use American power smarter, we honor our military more, we take care of our veterans better. Because of the hard lessons of Vietnam, because of you, America is even stronger than before.”

As part of the rewrite, they move the start of our involvement to 1962. Of course, our involvement began in 1944/45 and by 62/63 Kennedy had made up his mind to withdraw, ordering McNamara to start drawing up plans for a complete withdrawal by 65.

Since we're under sequester, why not save time and money by letting poet and USMC vet W.D. Ehrhart sum up the war in 66 words:


Guerrilla War

It’s practically impossible
to tell civilians
from the Vietcong.

Nobody wears uniforms.
They all talk
the same language,
(and you couldn’t understand them
even if they didn’t).

They tape grenades
inside their clothes,
and carry satchel charges
in their market baskets.

Even their women fight,
and young boys,
and girls.

It’s practically impossible
to tell civilians
from the Vietcong.

After awhile,
you quit trying.

pls write 'the secret history of the vietnam war'.

btw... what do you think of kissinger?

[Woodsman]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

They got that covered, reggie:

http://www.vietnamwar50th.com/

It's a 13 year effort to propagandize us into thinking just that. Here's the President at the kick off:

"Because of Vietnam and our veterans, we now use American power smarter, we honor our military more, we take care of our veterans better. Because of the hard lessons of Vietnam, because of you, America is even stronger than before.”

As part of the rewrite, they move the start of our involvement to 1962. Of course, our involvement began in 1944/45 and by 62/63 Kennedy had made up his mind to withdraw, ordering McNamara to start drawing up plans for a complete withdrawal by 65.

Since we're under sequester, why not save time and money by letting poet and USMC vet W.D. Ehrhart sum up the war in 66 words:


Guerrilla War

It’s practically impossible
to tell civilians
from the Vietcong.

Nobody wears uniforms.
They all talk
the same language,
(and you couldn’t understand them
even if they didn’t).

They tape grenades
inside their clothes,
and carry satchel charges
in their market baskets.

Even their women fight,
and young boys,
and girls.

It’s practically impossible
to tell civilians
from the Vietcong.

After awhile,
you quit trying.

[reggie]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

Great deleted scene from Apocalypse Now.... explains how the simulacra is played-out on the public....the US created the Viet Minh...this scene made it into the version of the film that played at the Cannes Film Festival. However, this entire part of the movie was censored BEFORE the film was publicly released. In the scene... Martin Sheen has discovered a Rubber Plantation still occupied by its French founders, who do not wish to leave Vietnam, ever. Sheen is having dinner with the French family and enters into a discussion about the war and its beginnings

[Dave Stratman]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

Thank you for posting that excellent example.

Another example of migrating society away from horizontal to vertical relationships is the use of generational labels in cultural segmentation (ie Gen-x; Gen-Y, etc.). By leveraging public education, Hollywood, Silicon Valley tech, the music industry, and Madison Avenue ad agencies, children were cultural shifted from family originated culture and behaviors toward [Theodor Adorno's] mass centralization of the same via vertical relationships with these cultural and educational suppliers.

Excellent point, Reggie.

[reggie]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

The real powers in society--the Masters of Great Wealth--make sure that, as far as possible, they control both sides of the debates in society. Republicans vs. Democrats, MSNBC vs. Fox, Judge Garrity or Ted Kennedy vs. Louise Day Hicks, even Capitalists vs. Communists: they all play their roles, with greater or lesser degree of consciousness, and the effects are the same: to lead people up blind alleys and to enforce elite rule. Judge Garrity/Ted Kennedy was directing people one way, LD Hicks another. Both paths appeared very different but were in essence the same.

What was so exciting to many people in Boston about our campaign for Better Education Together is that we were a real opposition to the busing plans. We said that, as parents, we felt trapped between two bad alternatives: a racist School Committee that had delivered an inferior education to all our children, white as well as black, and a Federal Court that was making things worse; that we shared the same hopes and dreams for our children; and that it was up to us to unite and fight for them. We broke out of the box of false alternatives--which pitted white against black and race against education--offered by the rulers.

Yes, Marx-Engels version of the dialectic in play. We also see non-profit organization pitted against so-called established state or corporate actors, alternative media vs mainstream media, nation (leader) versus nation (leader), etc. What's critical is the marginalization of any real opposition to the manufactured dialectic, which is exactly what Dave experienced. This is what we're witnessing right now, for example with Wikileaks, but that's a matter for an entirely different thread that will most likely not be well received here.

[Dave Stratman]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

Thank you for the in-person experience.

I do find it interesting that someone in the 'opposing' group wound up getting into Congress, as a Senator no less.

Doesn't seem very consistent with the NWO uber alles.

The phrase "NWO uber alles" it certainly isn't mine, but you're right, I did present only one aspect of how the rulers promote a strategy and didn't mention the other roles people play in carrying it out. (Incidentally Louise Day Hicks was not a Senator but a Representative.)

I once asked Al Shanker--a few moments after he had trounced the opposing candidate for president of the AFT--how he won so big. He replied, "I choose my opponents very carefully."

The real powers in society--the Masters of Great Wealth--make sure that, as far as possible, they control both sides of the debates in society. Republicans vs. Democrats, MSNBC vs. Fox, Judge Garrity or Ted Kennedy vs. Louise Day Hicks, even Capitalists vs. Communists: they all play their roles, with greater or lesser degree of consciousness, and the effects are the same: to lead people up blind alleys and to enforce elite rule. Judge Garrity/Ted Kennedy was directing people one way, LD Hicks another. Both paths appeared very different but were in essence the same.

What was so exciting to many people in Boston about our campaign for Better Education Together is that we were a real opposition to the busing plans. We said that, as parents, we felt trapped between two bad alternatives: a racist School Committee that had delivered an inferior education to all our children, white as well as black, and a Federal Court that was making things worse; that we shared the same hopes and dreams for our children; and that it was up to us to unite and fight for them. We broke out of the box of false alternatives--which pitted white against black and race against education--offered by the rulers.

[c1ue]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

My experiences during busing opened my eyes on the role of liberalism as a means of social control. The vigorously pro-busing mayor of Boston at the time was the very liberal Kevin White. The two best-known racist leaders of the anti-busing movement were Louise Day Hicks and Pixie Palladino. Louise Day Hicks went from a seat on the Boston School Committee to Congress. Pixie took a School Committee seat as Louise left. Here's the kicker: both their husbands were employed during all those years by Mayor White.

Thank you for the in-person experience.

I do find it interesting that someone in the 'opposing' group wound up getting into Congress, as a Senator no less.

Doesn't seem very consistent with the NWO uber alles.

[reggie]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

Affirmative Action was a brilliant riposte to the winning efforts of Civil Rights. The jujitsu performed on the so-called Women's Movement is another jaw-dropper. Perhaps this "5th Gen Warfare only works to maximum effect on the domestic population. (See today's WikiLeaks revelations on the success of 5th Gen in Afghanistan)

Precisely!!!!

By the way, WikiLeaks is 5GW.

[don]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

Thanks, Don. I agree, Liberalism is a powerful and, in my view, still the dominant ideology of social control, though it can take many forms. For what it's worth, here's my take on affirmative action:

AFFIRMATIVE ACTION-or CLASS SOLIDARITY? A New Democracy Flyer (newdemocracyworld.org) There are good people trapped on both sides of the affirmative action debate. We think there is a way out of the trap which can unite working men and women of all races. TWO SIDES OF THE SAME COIN The liberal and conservative positions on affirmative action claim to be opposites. In fact they amount to the same bad idea. Liberals support affirmative action, saying that it is important to make competition between the races and genders fair; by favoring one group over another now, liberals say, affirmative action makes up for past discrimination. Conservatives oppose affirmative action, saying that, by favoring one group over another, affirmative action unfairly affects competition between individuals. The liberal and conservative positions on affirmative action both favor the idea of competition. They share the view that society consists of groups and individuals all competing in a war against everyone else for jobs and other goods. Liberal and conservative both accept class inequality as permanent and competition among working people as good. WHAT "GROUP" DO YOU BELONG TO? The corporate and government elite always tell us to identify with one group against all others. "What group are you part of?" they ask. "Asian male?" "Black female?" "Angry white male?" People care most about what they have in common, but the government stresses the differences. People know there has always been discrimination in job and other opportunities. Yet people also know that more discrimination, even in the name of "fairness," attacks people's natural inclinations to overcome differences and work together. Affirmative action continues the game of pitting people against each other. It distorts what people mean by racial justice, which would require decent jobs for all. Instead the government promotes unemployment while it encourages competition among racial groups. There is only one "group" that the powerful do not want us to identify with-the working class. The ruling elite know that they can keep groups based on race or gender fighting each other forever. The elite cannot control a united working class. SCARCITY IS ARTIFICIAL The elite force us to compete for scarce jobs and necessities like medical care. But the scarcity of jobs and other goods is artificial. The US economy is more productive than ever. The corporate and government elite intentionally cut jobs and programs, while taking an even greater share of the wealth for themselves. While corporations lay off millions, the government gives them tax rebates to ship jobs overseas. The government cuts taxes on the rich, then slashes Medicare for workers, saying that there's no money to pay for it. The goal of job and program cuts is to control people by making them feel insecure. PART OF A LARGER BATTLE The debate over affirmative action is part of a larger battle over the direction of society. Politicians may play roles as "liberals" or "conservatives," but they all have the same goal: to tighten elite control over working people. They promote competition in every way they can. Most working people believe in equality and solidarity of all workers. We have been at a terrible disadvantage in this battle, however, because no working class leadership has firmly rejected both affirmative action and discrimination of all kinds in favor of solidarity of working people against elite rule. SOLIDARITY: THE ANSWER TO DISCRIMINATION Solidarity is the answer to discrimination. The real struggle for equality has always come from the solidarity of working people in their everyday lives. Let's continue and extend the fight: Build bridges among people in your plant or neighborhood. Stand up if any of your brothers or sisters is treated unfairly. Fight against all layoffs. Slow down against speed-up. Refuse overtime, so businesses are forced to hire more workers. Support strikes and spread them. Fight for real equality: not the false equality of fighting each other for a handful of jobs, but a world where the wealth we create is ours. Please copy this flyer and pass it on.

Affirmative Action was a brilliant riposte to the winning efforts of Civil Rights. The jujitsu performed on the so-called Women's Movement is another jaw-dropper. Perhaps this "5th Gen Warfare only works to maximum effect on the domestic population. (See today's WikiLeaks revelations on the success of 5th Gen in Afghanistan)

[reggie]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

When considering my contribution to the 5GW discussion, we should consider the ratio of horizontal to vertical relationships in a human terrain area (be it a nation-state, sub culture, community, etc).

Thank you for posting that excellent example.

Another example of migrating society away from horizontal to vertical relationships is the use of generational labels in cultural segmentation (ie Gen-x; Gen-Y, etc.). By leveraging public education, Hollywood, Silicon Valley tech, the music industry, and Madison Avenue ad agencies, children were cultural shifted from family originated culture and behaviors toward [Theodor Adorno's] mass centralization of the same via vertical relationships with these cultural and educational suppliers.

[Dave Stratman]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

Americans are generally clueless as to the real role of Liberalism, including Affirmative Action, Quota Systems, etc. Thanks for posting.

Thanks, Don. I agree, Liberalism is a powerful and, in my view, still the dominant ideology of social control, though it can take many forms. For what it's worth, here's my take on affirmative action:

AFFIRMATIVE ACTION-or CLASS SOLIDARITY? A New Democracy Flyer (newdemocracyworld.org) There are good people trapped on both sides of the affirmative action debate. We think there is a way out of the trap which can unite working men and women of all races. TWO SIDES OF THE SAME COIN The liberal and conservative positions on affirmative action claim to be opposites. In fact they amount to the same bad idea. Liberals support affirmative action, saying that it is important to make competition between the races and genders fair; by favoring one group over another now, liberals say, affirmative action makes up for past discrimination. Conservatives oppose affirmative action, saying that, by favoring one group over another, affirmative action unfairly affects competition between individuals. The liberal and conservative positions on affirmative action both favor the idea of competition. They share the view that society consists of groups and individuals all competing in a war against everyone else for jobs and other goods. Liberal and conservative both accept class inequality as permanent and competition among working people as good. WHAT "GROUP" DO YOU BELONG TO? The corporate and government elite always tell us to identify with one group against all others. "What group are you part of?" they ask. "Asian male?" "Black female?" "Angry white male?" People care most about what they have in common, but the government stresses the differences. People know there has always been discrimination in job and other opportunities. Yet people also know that more discrimination, even in the name of "fairness," attacks people's natural inclinations to overcome differences and work together. Affirmative action continues the game of pitting people against each other. It distorts what people mean by racial justice, which would require decent jobs for all. Instead the government promotes unemployment while it encourages competition among racial groups. There is only one "group" that the powerful do not want us to identify with-the working class. The ruling elite know that they can keep groups based on race or gender fighting each other forever. The elite cannot control a united working class. SCARCITY IS ARTIFICIAL The elite force us to compete for scarce jobs and necessities like medical care. But the scarcity of jobs and other goods is artificial. The US economy is more productive than ever. The corporate and government elite intentionally cut jobs and programs, while taking an even greater share of the wealth for themselves. While corporations lay off millions, the government gives them tax rebates to ship jobs overseas. The government cuts taxes on the rich, then slashes Medicare for workers, saying that there's no money to pay for it. The goal of job and program cuts is to control people by making them feel insecure. PART OF A LARGER BATTLE The debate over affirmative action is part of a larger battle over the direction of society. Politicians may play roles as "liberals" or "conservatives," but they all have the same goal: to tighten elite control over working people. They promote competition in every way they can. Most working people believe in equality and solidarity of all workers. We have been at a terrible disadvantage in this battle, however, because no working class leadership has firmly rejected both affirmative action and discrimination of all kinds in favor of solidarity of working people against elite rule. SOLIDARITY: THE ANSWER TO DISCRIMINATION Solidarity is the answer to discrimination. The real struggle for equality has always come from the solidarity of working people in their everyday lives. Let's continue and extend the fight: Build bridges among people in your plant or neighborhood. Stand up if any of your brothers or sisters is treated unfairly. Fight against all layoffs. Slow down against speed-up. Refuse overtime, so businesses are forced to hire more workers. Support strikes and spread them. Fight for real equality: not the false equality of fighting each other for a handful of jobs, but a world where the wealth we create is ours. Please copy this flyer and pass it on.

[Dave Stratman]

Re: Fifth Generation of Warfare (5GW) is "indistinguishable from magic"

This may be, but perhaps you could illuminate who exactly were the 'rulers' in this case.

Was it a judge/the court system? Was it a federal commission or agency?

According to Wiki, it was a specific judge implementing the plan of the Massachusetts State Board of Education - opposed by the Boston School Committee



Garrity in turn was a Lyndon Johnson appointee and furthermore a Massachusetts native. Outside of the general 'Great Society' meme, it is unclear to me just how Garrity fits into this NWO-like construct.

The "Great Society" reflected a strategy of social control developed by government policy makers, think tanks and university seminars (the Ford Foundation, Rockefeller Foundation, Brookings Institute, Kennedy School of Government, the Woodrow Wilson Institute, the Foreign Policy Association, etc.) as a sophisticated means of controlling an increasingly rebellious populace--most visibly Black people engaged in the civil rights movement and urban rebellions, but also a wide range of working class whites in Appalachian coal mines, auto factories, the construction trades, the military, and elsewhere. The Great Society was meant to channel the popular forces of change into a safe legal and institutional framework and to enforce the lesson that positive change comes from the elite, not from the masses.

The Great Society concept was developed by intellectuals in the service of our rulers, but carried out by a whole range of people. Politicians, state and local governments, federal courts, the media--all had roles to play to carry out the strategy. Not that the government or a cabal of powerful people can flick a switch and make things happen. But when the class that is in possession of the State has determined on a course of action, it has a thousand ways of bringing many actors into the strategy and prepping them on their roles. For example, politicians and higher-level civil servants in D.C. are brought into frequent rounds of seminars and retreats where people higher up the ladder and better connected than the audience share with the audience their opinions of available and desirable policy options.

It's not terribly subtle. You get clued in on what to think, who is thinking it, and where a successful career path lies. This doesn't mean that the participants are necessarily insincere; the policy proposals are generally very well thought out and plausible. All you have to do is to accept the fundamental assumption--positive change comes from the top--and the rest follows. (I served a year--1976-77--as an Education Policy Fellow in the U.S. Office of Education, Department of HEW, and was treated to a number of such seminars.)

School desegregation was one application of the Great Society concept wherein the same entity that is prosecuting a criminal war in Vietnam magically becomes the savior of black people here at home. By stirring up fighting between blacks and whites, busing also presented a picture of white working people as deeply racist and not to be trusted. Those images of Black children being stoned in South Boston were deeply demoralizing to millions of people and made the idea of bottom-up social change seem highly unrealistic.

Did Judge Garrity realize that he was playing a deeply destructive role in the Boston schools? I suspect he knew what he was doing, but perhaps not. All he had to believe--and I think it highly likely that he felt this--was that White Bostonians were deeply racist and Black Bostonians deeply ignorant, and that neither were competent to make a plan for better and desegregated schools together, so Garrity appointed "experts" from Boston University and Harvard to come up with plans. He had no intention of allowing mere parents to have a say in the disposition of the schools. When we, an intergrated group of Boston Public School parents, attempted to become a party to the suit, he denied our petition. The message was clear: shut up and listen to your betters. I remember about a year later telling Herman Goldberg, U.S. Director of Civil Rights Policy (I think that was his title), that Black parents in Boston were as opposed to the busing as White parents, and he replied, "These people don't know their own interests."

Remember also that there had been years of "scholarship" by well-known academics claiming that integration--that it, sitting next to white students--was the answer to low school achievement by black students. (My mind is blanking on the guy who wrote the book on that.)

My experiences during busing opened my eyes on the role of liberalism as a means of social control. The vigorously pro-busing mayor of Boston at the time was the very liberal Kevin White. The two best-known racist leaders of the anti-busing movement were Louise Day Hicks and Pixie Palladino. Louise Day Hicks went from a seat on the Boston School Committee to Congress. Pixie took a School Committee seat as Louise left. Here's the kicker: both their husbands were employed during all those years by Mayor White.

Times have changed dramatically, of course, since then, and the Great Society meme has been replaced with the "free markets" meme, and I'm sure we'll have others along the way. But they'll all have essentially the same goal: control the people.