Alternative to World War III

[Fiat Currency]

Re: Alternative to World War III

The real question is "will ET accept dollars, for oil or finished goods, can ET change lead into gold?"

Heck, we can change lead into gold using nuclear technology today. It's just not economically viable.

They'll need to do something far more advanced ... like turning fiat into something that doesn't devalue.

Pot of gold 76x80.gif

[charliebrown]

Re: Alternative to World War III

The real question is "will ET accept dollars, for oil or finished goods, can ET change lead into gold?"

[don]

Re: Alternative to World War III

"Now Zerocred is talking about SETI contact with ET as a political distraction."


from the Washington Times:

God’s creation of the Earth, Noah and the flood, Moses at the Red Sea: These pivotal stories from the Old Testament still resonate deeply with most Americans, who take the accounts literally rather than as a symbolic lesson.

An ABC News poll released Sunday found that 61 percent of Americans believe the account of creation in the Bible’s book of Genesis is “literally true” rather than a story meant as a “lesson.”

Sixty percent believe in the story of Noah’s ark and a global flood, while 64 percent agree that Moses parted the Red Sea to save fleeing Jews from their Egyptian captors.

A Harris poll of 2,201 adults charting “Religious and Other Beliefs of Americans 2003” found last year that 93 percent of the nation’s Christians believe in miracles, 95 percent in heaven, 93 percent in the virgin birth of Christ and 96 percent in Christ’s resurrection.


Sounds like a slam dunk to me . . .

[thriftyandboringinohio]

Re: Alternative to World War III

The following is a response to xPat's EJ, you are WAY out of line here! :-) post on one of EJ's threads.

My response is waay too far out for that thread, so I am posting it here, over in Rand and Rave, where it will feel more comfortable, with but a link to this post from EJ's thread


Another possibility, instead of WWIII, that will seem really too far out to most everyone here: a faked alien invasion, but real enough to be very scary at the time. Think 9/11, times ten, with UFO craft doing things your college physics book says can't be done. Such could provide the galvanizing impetus for a global governance and monetary reset. As best as I can figure, the (human) black ops programs have the technology means to accomplish this.

Holy Cow! (pun intended)
Now Zerocred is talking about SETI contact with ET as a political distraction.

If this pans out, EJ might need to change ThePythonicCow's title from "High Commissioner" to "Oracle"

[raja]

Re: Alternative to World War III

Another possibility, instead of WWIII, that will seem really too far out to most everyone here: a faked alien invasion, but real enough to be very scary at the time.

I suspect there have been some amongst TPTB who have considered a faked alien invasion as a viable way to manipulate the public. But I think the overall TPTB consensus would be that this strategy wouldn't work, so it won't be tried. Too unbelievable in the modern world.

Now, they might try to fake a 2nd Coming
Add religion and faith to the mix and rationality goes out the door.

[Fiat Currency]

Re: Alternative to World War III

... a faked alien invasion, but real enough to be very scary at the time.

Well (FWIW) Paul Krugman not only agrees with you ... he said so on CNN ... a fake alien invasion would be good for the economy.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1Fzzs7oVaA

You can't make this stuff up.

Peace be with you TPC.

[metalman]

Re: Alternative to World War III

That Small Wars Journal forum looks interesting. Thanks for adding that and damn you for finding something yet again that will take up even more time!

+1 great site. thx.

[doom&gloom]

Re: Alternative to World War III

That Small Wars Journal forum looks interesting. Thanks for adding that and damn you for finding something yet again that will take up even more time!

[lakedaemonian]

Re: Alternative to World War III

Of his integrity I have no doubt. A poseur? Absolutely not. The things he talked about weren't common knowledge among his friends and acquaintances. I'm pretty sure that aside from his wife, my husband was the only person he told, and it was years after the fact.

There are many levels of black ops. Most don't involve the things c1ue mentioned, and I don't know how secrets like those could be kept. But there's a lot of lower level drug and arms running, cross border contacts, surveillance and yes, killing that the government wants done off the books. That he was capable of such things and temperamentally suited for the work.. I have absolutely no doubt.

If he possesses integrity and is a genuine BTDT(been there done that) kind of fella, then the possibility of him or peers who also possess integrity and faithfully fulfill their oaths of service then the odds of their being involved in conspiracy theory shenanigans is pretty low.

Just like the odds of running into genuine "black ops" ninjas who willingly discuss considerable details of their careers is fairly low....the odds of such folks being posers is quite high....not an attack on you or your friend.....but those ARE the odds...it's very easy to find or provide substantiation.

To Doom&Gloom's point of folks keeping secrets forever.....again...that plays towards integrity...those filtered for it, possess it..those that don't are filtered out....those left are far, far less likely to do things they know they shouldn't be doing and swore they wouldn't.

As to the "many levels of black ops" quote, no offense intended, but I don't think you actually possess the subject matter knowledge to make that claim and it seems irrelevant if we agree that integrity is a key/core trait for folks who pass through the various integrity and training filters to perform unconventional tasks on behalf of their nation/government.

Once again, the general public's perceptions of special operations and intelligence operations are often based on melodramatic Hollywood content and often highly inaccurate in the mass media news.

My experience and exposure to it is both 1st(limited) and 2nd hand(more broad based across a number of relevant countries) from a good number of folks within that community including a couple of mentors with considerable relevant experience.

This is my last post on this topic as I'd prefer to reduce the chance of potentially embarrassing myself in front of any of my peers who may choose to visit this forum(I've suggested this forum to many folks I know with a current or prior service background).

This is another example of where I'd really like to see a couple folks with relevant military/security subject matter expertise(far, far, far beyond my limited experience and exposure) help focus perception in an accurate direction...much as EJ has helped focus my generally parallel perspective in all things finance and economics.

I would highly recommend the Small Wars Journal forum. It's the iTulip of the forward thinking defense/security community. Very well regarded.

To be blunt...while I agree that conflict risk is rising and that the military/intelligence/defense/security community have been far from faultless in recent years....I can't help but think the perceptions here of it are at times as inaccurate as the perceptions of the general public regarding this financial crisis/process.

In my opinion, as I've stated before, this is an area of weakness on this forum.

[doom&gloom]

Re: Alternative to World War III

Of his integrity I have no doubt. A poseur? Absolutely not. The things he talked about weren't common knowledge among his friends and acquaintances. I'm pretty sure that aside from his wife, my husband was the only person he told, and it was years after the fact.

There are many levels of black ops. Most don't involve the things c1ue mentioned, and I don't know how secrets like those could be kept. But there's a lot of lower level drug and arms running, cross border contacts, surveillance and yes, killing that the government wants done off the books. That he was capable of such things and temperamentally suited for the work.. I have absolutely no doubt.

There are plenty of people who can keep a secret -- forever. I am one of them. You can tell me something in confidence and it will nevr get shared with anyone if make that an explicit request. I have personally never understood why so many people need to "run off at the mouth" with stuff others told them. Just because you know something does not mean you have to be a walking talking billboard.

So when people question whether there are people who can keep secrets forever, I could easily say yes, such people exist.

[Ellen Z]

Re: Alternative to World War III

In a space of about ten years (the 1930's), while much of the rest of the Western world was in the midst of a Great Depression, Germany went from being a defeated basket case to arguably the world's strongest military power.

For some years, Germany could be perceived as a potential counterweight against the Soviet Union.

Hitler became chancellor of Germany in January 1933; the country rejected the Versailles Treaty and began to re-arm in 1935. During the the Spanish Civil War (1936–39) Germany and the Soviet Union were on opposite sides, Hitler sent military aid to Franco while the Soviet Union backed the Spanish republic.

This alignment changes on August 23, 1939, when the Soviet Union and Germany sign a pact defining their separate spheres of interest. A week later, the Germans invade Poland. On Sept. 17 the Soviet Union invades Poland from the east, and soon after occupies Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, and parts of Romania.

This alignment changes again on June 22, 1941 when Germany invades the Soviet Union.

[shiny!]

Re: Alternative to World War III

Agreed....and a couple key points to add:

*There are a STAGGERING number of people who CLAIM special operations experience, but are really sad posers....STAGGERING numbers of them. Whether it be claimed special operations experience in Vietnam, Desert Storm, Somalia, Iraq, Afghanistan...or claiming POW status, or claiming to be recipients of the Congressional Medal of Honor, etc...it is a literal epidemic of lies....if anyone wants evidence of these losers(including some "sources" for the conspiracy theory crowd) I'd be happy to provide links of this epidemic.

*Most folks who DO possess special operations experience are not the type of folks who would be quick and easy to share it willy nilly outside of their inner circle of family and friends once retired.

*Of the folks in the special operations community I've had the opportunity to work with, learn from, and just enjoy a few pints with the...the single word that best describes and ties them all together is INTEGRITY.

Folks without it are largely filtered out quite early on in respective nations units' selection processes.

The risk of allowing folks who lack integrity to participate in sensitive activities on behalf of their nations would be catastrophically high.

I think some people are watching too much Hollywood interpretation of "black ops".

Integrity

Of his integrity I have no doubt. A poseur? Absolutely not. The things he talked about weren't common knowledge among his friends and acquaintances. I'm pretty sure that aside from his wife, my husband was the only person he told, and it was years after the fact.

There are many levels of black ops. Most don't involve the things c1ue mentioned, and I don't know how secrets like those could be kept. But there's a lot of lower level drug and arms running, cross border contacts, surveillance and yes, killing that the government wants done off the books. That he was capable of such things and temperamentally suited for the work.. I have absolutely no doubt.

[lakedaemonian]

Re: Alternative to World War III

There is no question that there are plenty of competent, or even ultra competent shooters.

That isn't the question though.

The question is: would your late husband's friend assassinate an American President and not speak of it ever?

Would your late husband's friend remote control a 757 into the World Trade Center buildings knowing thousands of Americans would die?

Would your late husband's friend plant WMD's in order to foment an excuse for a regime change in Iraq?

Agreed....and a couple key points to add:

*There are a STAGGERING number of people who CLAIM special operations experience, but are really sad posers....STAGGERING numbers of them. Whether it be claimed special operations experience in Vietnam, Desert Storm, Somalia, Iraq, Afghanistan...or claiming POW status, or claiming to be recipients of the Congressional Medal of Honor, etc...it is a literal epidemic of lies....if anyone wants evidence of these losers(including some "sources" for the conspiracy theory crowd) I'd be happy to provide links of this epidemic.

*Most folks who DO possess special operations experience are not the type of folks who would be quick and easy to share it willy nilly outside of their inner circle of family and friends once retired.

*Of the folks in the special operations community I've had the opportunity to work with, learn from, and just enjoy a few pints with the...the single word that best describes and ties them all together is INTEGRITY.

Folks without it are largely filtered out quite early on in respective nations units' selection processes.

The risk of allowing folks who lack integrity to participate in sensitive activities on behalf of their nations would be catastrophically high.

I think some people are watching too much Hollywood interpretation of "black ops".

Integrity

[c1ue]

Re: Alternative to World War III

FWIW, and that's arguably not much, one of my late husband's best friends was a professional airline pilot and world-class marksman who flew black ops missions for several years. He had utter contempt for the bureaucrats you speak of, but a great deal of respect for the agents he flew- at least for their skills. He himself was no one you wanted to cross. He was always smiling, always polite, seriously twisted under the surface, and absolutely deadly. For some reason he took a great liking to my husband. Personally, I was scared to death of him. He passed away several years ago.

I watched him shoot a three-stage match: revolver, rifle and shotgun. His time was almost 2 seconds faster than the next fastest shooter (who was a seasoned competitor in his own right), yet he was so smooth it looked like he was suspending time and moving in slow motion. I've seen a lot of good shooters in my life, but he was in a class all his own. Having seen him in action, it's no mystery to me why the black-ops agents have such a "mystical" reputation.

There is no question that there are plenty of competent, or even ultra competent shooters.

That isn't the question though.

The question is: would your late husband's friend assassinate an American President and not speak of it ever?

Would your late husband's friend remote control a 757 into the World Trade Center buildings knowing thousands of Americans would die?

Would your late husband's friend plant WMD's in order to foment an excuse for a regime change in Iraq?

[shiny!]

Re: Alternative to World War III

In my view, black ops capabilities extend well past individual skills. Unless you have plenty of spare time on your hands, I'd not recommend going down this rabbit hole. It's actually more like Mammoth Cave than a rabbit hole. You'll end up totally rethinking your physics, history, cosmology, and more before you're done. The technology available to the black ops folks is impossible, according to "modern" physics.

My husband's father and uncle worked for Dow chemical. He told me that when he was a boy, his father told him that he had personally seen a transporter device in a laboratory. This was in the 60's, I believe. According to his dad, the scientists had managed to transport a tea cup from one room to another. The problem was that it didn't arrive intact, but as a pile of dust...

Come to think of it, our friend did tell us some fantastic stories. Things like how the government was going to change the money by putting embedded technology in it (that happened) and changing its color to purple (that didn't happen). He said he had actually seen the purple money. That was about 20 years ago. When the money stayed green, I figured he was spinning tall tales... until they started putting those metal strips in the bills.

I initially doubted his story about flying black ops when he was younger, until I saw his scars and how he flew. On my wall is a picture of him standing in front of his little plane with a big grin on his face. The top of the aircraft's tail has grass stains on the edge because he had just flown over a field upside down, with the tail of the plane grazing the grass.

He was quite the philosopher when it came to physics, his favorite saying being, "Fit is a function of velocity."