Wall St protest gaining strengh?

[c1ue]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

I asked that you provide a clear link between any rentier of your choice with the OWS movement.

Such evidence is quite clear and unequivocal between the Kochs and the Tea Party. Such links also exist between Soros and the color revolutions.

Why is it all your ominous pronouncements and theoretically wise comments cannot answer this simple request?

You have also continued to not answer the question on just how OWS is beneficial given it directly attacks the seat of Soros' and other banksters power.

[Sutter Cane]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

Another thread derailed. Reggie, why not start your own thread on this topic? The rest of you, please do not feed the trolls.

Duly noted. I didn't notice, or hadn't remembered, Reggie's previous posts so I didn't know his track record.

Conspiracy types seem incapable of writing clearly and succinctly. Although that last cut n' paste was terribly long and convoluted, I could at least pick out enough to finally see what the author was getting at. I hadn't encountered this "Frankfurt School" meme before, but some quick googling turned up this pithy summary:

The idea is that a small group of Marxist Jews who formed the Frankfurt School set out to destroy Western Culture through a conspiracy to promote multiculturalism and collectivist economic theories.

There - stated clearly in one sentence! What is so hard about that?

Apparently this meme has been around for awhile, but only recently has it become more mainstream. It's a line of thinking popular with Andrew Breitbart and Anders Breivik, among others.

See summaries here:

http://crooksandliars.com/david-neiw...ik-was-ardent-

and here:

http://us-intellectual-history.blogspot.com/2011/07/frankfurt-school-right-wing-conspiracy.html

I'll file "The Frankfurt School" alongside the likes of "chemtrails" and know better next time.

[Thailandnotes]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

History ryhmes.
A good long read.
http://history.hanover.edu/hhr/99/hhr99_2.html

[mesyn191]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

I'll file "The Frankfurt School" alongside the likes of "chemtrails" and know better next time.

Thanks for cracking the code in his posts I guess. Your filing cabinet sounds adequately organized to me!

[dcarrigg]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

I asked that you provide a clear link between any rentier of your choice with the OWS movement.

Such evidence is quite clear and unequivocal between the Kochs and the Tea Party. Such links also exist between Soros and the color revolutions.

Why is it all your ominous pronouncements and theoretically wise comments cannot answer this simple request?

You have also continued to not answer the question on just how OWS is beneficial given it directly attacks the seat of Soros' and other banksters power.

I don't think you'll find a direct connection. They only have $300k. It's not impossible to gather that in small chunks given the support we've seen.

I found this interesting (from 538):



It seems to me that the media cultures are completely different. One looks like it grew and went viral, the other looks logarithmic, as in a more traditional TV-age PR campaign.

Keeping an eye on these shapes could be telling for incidents in the future (this wasn't the point of the 538 article, it simply occurred to me).

[aaron]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

Thank you.

[reggie]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

I asked that you provide a clear link between any rentier of your choice with the OWS movement.

I have, twice.

I believe the problem here is the different frames from which we interpret the material. My suggestion is to revisit the story of Socrates' life and death, namely, who he was trying to influence, the purpose of said influence, and the beneficiaries of this. Not much has changed since then, except for the techniques at play. Perhaps that will place the material into a more appropriate context

Conspiracy types seem incapable of writing clearly and succinctly. Although that last cut n' paste was terribly long and convoluted, I could at least pick out enough to finally see what the author was getting at. I hadn't encountered this "Frankfurt School" meme before, but some quick googling turned up this pithy summary:

[snip]

I'll file "The Frankfurt School" alongside the likes of "chemtrails" and know better next time.

Unbelievable, we have one of the most influential institutions of the 20th century on Critical Theory & Modernity, with credible and acclaimed academics such as Marcuse, Horkheimer & Adorno. But somehow, you've managed to find some dribble on the Interwebs and use that in your post to frame this institution, and thereby my posts. Why would anyone grant this sort of irresponsible research merit when these academics have many publications available on Amazon and for download online. Surely, someone would want to at least peruse the work of these men before casting judgement.

Thanks for cracking the code in his posts I guess. Your filing cabinet sounds adequately organized to me!

Let's see, I've cited a US Naval Academy speech, interviews with the former head of the JFK school at Harvard, Karl Popper, the academics at the Frankfurt School, Jacques Ellul, and Sourcewatch, but somehow all of this is to be relegated to the dustbin filing system.

Wow, just wow.

[c1ue]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

I have, twice.

I believe the problem here is the different frames from which we interpret the material. My suggestion is to revisit the story of Socrates' life and death, namely, who he was trying to influence, the purpose of said influence, and the beneficiaries of this. Not much has changed since then, except for the techniques at play. Perhaps that will place the material into a more appropriate context.

Sorry, but you have not.

You've slapped up a pastiche which does not in any way connect OWS with anything Soros, US government, or whatever.

How about using lines?

OWS <-- OWS leader <-- intermediate organization <-- cutout NGO <-- bankster or US government

You have posted about The two right boxes, but nothing else.

And Socrates is irrelevant to this discussion.

The Socratic method is primarily to disguise the ignorance of the instructor.

[Sutter Cane]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

Unbelievable, we have one of the most influential institutions of the 20th century on Critical Theory & Modernity, with credible and acclaimed academics such as Marcuse, Horkheimer & Adorno. But somehow, you've managed to find some dribble on the Interwebs and use that in your post to frame this institution, and thereby my posts. Why would anyone grant this sort of irresponsible research merit when these academics have many publications available on Amazon and for download online. Surely, someone would want to at least peruse the work of these men before casting judgement.

Let's see, I've cited a US Naval Academy speech, interviews with the former head of the JFK school at Harvard, Karl Popper, the academics at the Frankfurt School, Jacques Ellul, and Sourcewatch, but somehow all of this is to be relegated to the dustbin filing system.

Wow, just wow.

Your posts are just the typical conspiracist MO, dressed up with some flowery language. Instead of "Check out this video I got from infowars.com! Stunning Revelations!" its "these academics have many publications available on Amazon and for download online. Surely, someone would want to at least peruse the work of these men before casting judgement." Uses bigger words but it's still the same b.s. Rather than explaining in your own words why a video or article you've cut and pasted is important, or how it illustrates your larger point, you reply along these lines:

I ask questions in order to initiate thought in the mind of the reade. Most American's brains are wired such that they will attack thought that is beyond a certain comfort level.... this is a chemical reaction that is not overtly controlled by the reader, but exists to subvert the message, nonetheless. To understand my message, the reader is going to have to be willing to undertake some research on their own. Asking me to spoon feed you will not work. Only you can rewire your own brain.

My time is valuable, I'm not going to spend it watching long-ass videos, reading lengthy cut n' paste articles, and whole books of obscure Marxist critical theorizing, just because I am prompted to do so by a poster on an internet forum who can't even succinctly explain his reasons for posting the material.

Even if you don't like the source, is this description of what you are getting at inaccurate?

"The idea is that a small group of Marxist Jews who formed the Frankfurt School set out to destroy Western Culture through a conspiracy to promote multiculturalism and collectivist economic theories."

I am not going to spend hours of time to studying something when a quick google of the Frankfurt School turns up discussions that all seem to repeat the same points, at sites that tend to be extreme right wing, anti-Semitic, LaRouche-y, and conspiracy oriented:

http://www.stormfront.org/forum/t357588/

http://theforbiddentruth.net/1623-frankfurt-school-conspiracy-corrupt.html

http://www.schillerinstitute.org/fid...frankfurt.html

Like I said, your posts remind me of the typical conspiracist MO. Check out any thread on Randi.org to see the same thing. Here's a example about a completely unrelated (OR IS IT? Bwah ha ha ha) conspiracy - the Franklin child prostitution ring allegations.

http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?t=64252&page=2

I would suggest reading the thread, perhaps you will gain some insight into how you come across in your posts. Notice how the complaints of the skeptical commenters as the thread progresses mirror those of the comments here:

I haven't watched the documentary, sorry, I don't feel like spending an hour of my life getting my IQ lowered.

You were welcomed here earlier today and given a list of behaviors that won't be looked at favorably here.

I can't recall if it was on the list, but the stereotypical CT behavior has been to simply tell others to watch a video, without specifying exactly what in the video you find to be good evidence. That won't get you very far here - we expect you to state your case yourself.

Just spell out all the stuff for one stop shopping on your part and others.

You get all your questions out up front and stop playing around we are ready for the big new bits of facts you are hiding, or holding on to.

SoG, I don't know what boards you've participated in before this one, but you need to realize something about the JREF Forum. In this post I've just quoted, there are two areas that we don't suffer well.

First, as I said before, in general we won't follow your advice to watch an hour-long video. You need to have some respect for us and tell us what evidence this video provides that you think is noteworthy. If there is a snippet of the video that's especially important, it would be OK to provide the time that it occurs in the video.

The second is very important. If you are the one making an extraordinary claim, then it is up to you to provide evidence.

How about you try to actually explain why you think it's important? With reference to the other links people have provided that shows a Grand Jury, who had a lot more info than any of us will ever have, didn't find the evidence compelling.

[astonas]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

Sutter Cane:

It appears that you are responding on the generous assumption that reggie is interested in communicating something to us. All evidence points to the exact opposite conclusion. If he wished to succinctly explain his logic, he could have done so without drowning it in numerous and lengthy pieces of "supporting evidence", and thereby consumed far less effort both on his part, and ours. Instead, it seems that his focus is on attracting and holding as much of our attention as he can, for as long as he can. This sad quest for attention is tragically common on the internet, and is best remedied by following the advice given previously in this discussion:

"Do not feed the Trolls"

As long as he gets a response from you, he is achieving his objective. Are you achieving yours?

[Sutter Cane]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

Sutter Cane:

It appears that you are responding on the generous assumption that reggie is interested in communicating something to us. All evidence points to the exact opposite conclusion. If he wished to succinctly explain his logic, he could have done so without drowning it in numerous and lengthy pieces of "supporting evidence", and thereby consumed far less effort both on his part, and ours. Instead, it seems that his focus is on attracting and holding as much of our attention as he can, for as long as he can. This sad quest for attention is tragically common on the internet, and is best remedied by following the advice given previously in this discussion:

"Do not feed the Trolls"

As long as he gets a response from you, he is achieving his objective. Are you achieving yours?

*sigh* You are correct, of course. I guess it is that I am used to the discourse on this site being a little more elevated than what you find on other forums in the internet cesspool, so it is hard to leave it unchallenged.

[astonas]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

*sigh* You are correct, of course. I guess it is that I am used to the discourse on this site being a little more elevated than what you find on other forums in the internet cesspool, so it is hard to leave it unchallenged.

Meh, Don't be hard on yourself, either. Anyone who genuinely tries to understand different points of view will at times fall into the same trap of engaging unproductively. And a site like this which is so solid overall does encourage one to let one's guard down, at times prematurely. I certainly know I've made that mistake here on occasion.

Since FRED can't possibly moderate all threads to that level of detail, it's up to us to help each other identify, isolate, and ignore, not those who we disagree with, but those who fail to follow the basic rules of polite, intelligent, and productive discourse. I know when I embark on an unproductive string of rants, I appreciate a gentle reminder that there were likely better places to direct my attention. I'm sure it won't be long before you have a chance to return the favor.

[leegs]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

Hmmm. I don't get that Reggie is just a troll. I really would like to see him clarify his point of view and not be so vague, because I think there is something there, but like others, I'm not willing to dig into his supporting evidence. Perhaps I'm naive though.

[oddlots]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

Reggie FWIW it strikes me that your method in general seems to be to read a lot of material on psy-ops for example and then look about the world to find historical incidents that appear to mirror the effects of such a "program" and then assume that the former is the cause of the latter.

There's a small missing step there no?

I seem to recall this ages ago with a case where you spun out some obscure military psy-ops concept to elaborate lengths that frankly just struck me as ridiculous. My thought at the time was I'm sure you can always find some article or theoretical paper that would seem to map onto what's going on but that's kind of falacy of "evidence fitting" no? There are no doubt thousands of such articles written every year. Where's the evidence that this paper or theory is actually being put into practice and causing the effect?

Frankly I haven't read the above, but thought it might help to give some feedback as to why I don't feel inclined to. Just my 2cents.

BTW what's so horrible about Karl Popper?

[Slimprofits]

Re: Wall St protest gaining strengh?

You guys still think it's gaining strength? If so, to what end?

A city of 10 million people and they could only get 5k into Times Square on Saturday...

The MSM cable networks stopped paying attention on Monday morning.

And now we have stories of infighting, disorganization, chaos:

http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2011/10...e_organiz.html

"You're not a real protestor!"