International Community gets a Fail in Honduras

[ThePythonicCow]

Re: International Community gets a Fail in Honduras

"NO! YOU'RE WRONG! THE GOVERNMENT IS POISONING MY WATER! THEY OVERTHREW DEMOCRACY IN HONDURAS! LYNDON LAROUCHE IS RIGHT!" :rolleyes:

Yes, they are poisoning my water. I go to some lengths to remove the chlorine and fluoride from my drinking water.

Yes, I suspect that Perkins is right that the U.S. overthrew the government in Honduras.

I don't read Larouche much, but if he's saying these things, he's more right than wrong.

Ridiculing these positions by shouting them in hyperbolic ALL-CAPS doesn't make them wrong. It doesn't even really contribute much to this discussion or our understanding.

P.S. -- Someday I really need to Photoshop my cow avatar to have a tinfoil hat.

[nathanhulick]

Re: International Community gets a Fail in Honduras

So you think Barack Obama, President of the United States, instructed the CIA to start a coup in Honduras?

Its funny to me that you stated it because you think that its completely preposterous that the President of the US would tell the CIA to start a coup in another country.

How can educated people in the United States not be aware that thats exactly what the CIA does, and thats exactly what all powerful governments try to do and have done since probably the dawn of time.

Its not as if the US hasnt in the past started coups in places like Iran, Haiti, Cuba, Iraq, Venezuela, and about 50 other places I could list.

[nathanhulick]

Re: International Community gets a Fail in Honduras

American foreign policy, especially in the era of the Iranian coup, had a simple basis, anti-communism thanks to our major competitor for world power the Soviet Union using communist and some socialist states as vassals against us, especially after your country where Mao overthrew Chiang and 25% of the world population became communist with a snap of the fingers. Mossadegh was a self-proclaimed socialist that campaigned to nationalize the Iranian oil industry. This obviously hurt the interests of the company that was heavily in Iranian Oil, British Petroleum, and with control of oil even then increasingly overlapping control of geopolitical order, the Brits and Americans organized a coup using anti-communism as the reason. Was that right? In hindsight, probably no, but a lot of things that happen in politics and geopolitics usually are not. And anyone that thinks the world order tends itself toward "100% morality and always do the right thing that doesn't hurt anyone" is living in fantasyland. That said, I back my country's actions more often than not. You may think the Chinese were wrong on some things they've done in the past 55 years but that doesn't you don't back their position most of the time. So using stuff from 55 years ago to say why something can't be done now is 100% wrong.

So Mao was wrong because he overthrew Chiang Kai Shek, who was trying to hold onto power as a dictator in China? He was so corrupt that for a few years, the US government even stopped giving him foreign aid.


Mosaddeq was not a socialist, by any means. He certainly wasnt a self avowed socialist, as you claim here.

What was so wrong about nationalizing the Iranian Oil industry? Do you not understand that in the preceding half century, the British government controlled Iran, and made deals where the British controlled government sold the Iranian Oil fields to the British government oil company. The idea that the British had some right to the Iranian oil fields because they basically "stole them fair and square" is crazy.

All your arguments are textbook examples of discredited propaganda from the Democratic or Republican parties.

[medved]

Re: International Community gets a Fail in Honduras

Mosaddeq was not a socialist, by any means. He certainly wasnt a self avowed socialist, as you claim here.

What was so wrong about nationalizing the Iranian Oil industry?

He definitely was a commie. There is nothing wrong with nationalizing oil, but if you don't know what a collective farm is, do some homework.

In reality, the CIA coup saved Iran from getting a stalinist regime.

AMOF, replacing shah by mullahs did not improve their life a bit, even made it worse.

[nathanhulick]

Re: International Community gets a Fail in Honduras

I always love how I can smell these people out. Present a fact, and their argument gets undercut so they deny the fact and present a news article from a pseudo-news website (real Orwellian isn't it? therealnews.com) that presents the point of view of the org. It's a classic LaRouche tactic. So what org do you work for?

Therealnews.com isnt a "pseudo-news website", although they are not part of the corporate media. By corporate media, I am talking about media which is wholly owned by large, multinational corporations. In other words, all the major media.

The Real News is a viewer funded news site that strives to provide independent, unbiased news sources. When you click on a news video, you get a short little advertisement from various famous supporters, such as Chomsky, Howard Zinn, etc. I guess you are of the opinion that those people are "pseudo-news" supporters.

Your "fact" is anything but.

[nathanhulick]

Re: International Community gets a Fail in Honduras

He definitely was a commie. There is nothing wrong with nationalizing oil, but if you don't know what a collective farm is, do some homework.

In reality, the CIA coup saved Iran from getting a stalinist regime.

AMOF, replacing shah by mullahs did not improve their life a bit, even made it worse.

No, he definitely was not a commie. Also not sure what "collective farms" have to do with any of this. Mossadegh wasnt overthrown because he was setting up a collective farm, not even US apologists make that claim.

It is good to know that people like you are around to help everyone else in the world govern themselves. Too bad those stupid Iranians dont understand they are better off with a brutal dictator supported by the US ruling over them.

[medved]

Re: International Community gets a Fail in Honduras

No, he definitely was not a commie. Also not sure what "collective farms" have to do with any of this. Mossadegh wasnt overthrown because he was setting up a collective farm, not even US apologists make that claim.

Officially he was not a commie. Collective farms is one of the major indicators of how far to the left a gov’t is ready to move. Collective farms in an agrarian country is the base of total control over population. From that point on he would quickly become a real commie with the help of his good neighbor, the USSR. It is this development that the US wanted to prevent.

It is good to know that people like you are around to help everyone else in the world govern themselves.

Not, really. I cannot make these people learn, they prefer staying with their delusions forever (or, until being educated in a labor camp).

Too bad those stupid Iranians dont understand they are better off with a brutal dictator supported by the US ruling over them.

They definitely are, if you compare the US-supported brutal dictator to USSR-supported brutal dictator or the wonderful mullahs that rule Iran.