While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

[Woodsman]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

What about Muslims? Aren't they exempt from some part of Obamacare?

What is their stance on gay marriage?

I respect their religious views, as I do other religions. However the arguments that come up about religion always focus on Christians but never
Muslims. Why is that if both might agree on a particular issue; for example gay marriage?

What about them? In the case of Hobby Lobby, I don't believe any Muslim organization or mosque provided an amicus brief in support or against.

In terms of raw headcount or percentages, Muslims, Hindus, Bahá'í, etc. are a tiny minority of the US population. Compared to Christians, smaller still. In terms of national influence, largely insignificant and a non-entity. Here is the breakdown in the US according to the wiki:

Christianity (73%)
Other Religions (6%)
Non-Religious (19%)
Don't know/Not Stated (2%)

The largest religion in the US is Christianity, claimed by the majority of the population. From those, roughly 48% of Americans are Protestants, 22% are Catholics, 2% are Mormons and 1% have affiliations with various other Christian denominations.

Why the focus on Christians? Because they've dominated religious expression in the US since the first Europeans arrived in the 1600s. Because it is not Jews or Muslims or Hindus who are using the courts to impose or gain special accommodations for their religious beliefs. Once it became clear to Jerry Falwell, Pat Robertson, Paul Weyrich, Terry Dolan, Richard Viguerie, Howard Phillips and the other leaders of the evangelical right wing that they would be unsuccessful in getting people to modify their private and public behavior through force of argument or appeals to authority, they sought to compel them by turning to politics and the courts. And by every measure they have been fabulously successful in their efforts. Muslims? Not so much.

I would note the various times and places where right wing evangelicals insist that the US is a Christian nation. I would also note that when Americans speak of God, most do so from a Christian perspective. When we say prayers as part of a convocation, most every one is of the Christian variety. Those places where there are still dry counties forbidding the sales of alcohol do so not from the perspective of the Koran or the Talmud, but from an interpretation of the Christian Bible. Same for those blue laws preventing alcohol sales on Sunday or before noon on Sunday.

Right wing evangelical Christians are fond of presenting themselves alternatively as supremely dominant or a persecuted minority. Which one is it?

[vt]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

What about Muslims? Aren't they exempt from some part of Obamacare?

What is their stance on gay marriage?

I respect their religious views, as I do other religions. However the arguments that come up about religion always focus on Christians but never
Muslims. Why is that if both might agree on a particular issue; for example gay marriage?

[vinoveri]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

re "conscience rights" and hobby lobby - i've been wondering if devout christian scientists can refuse to offer any health insurance whatsoever. and whether jehovah's witnesses can exclude coverage for transfusions.

I've been wondering why abortion wasn't/isn't a required coverage?
No rhyme or reason as far as I can tell, just politics and pushing the envelope as far as one can ... and knowing where to stop ... at least at this point (sort of like the founding fathers not doing away with slavery in order to get what they want?)


Why should Chick-fila be allowed to shutter its doors on Sunday's? Why should those churches get a tax-break? After all those church-goers ain't producing or spendin nuttin on sunday; gud-dum pinkos, knocking 1/7 off the potential GDP by sitting out one day a week. Oughta be a law

[Woodsman]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

re "conscience rights" and hobby lobby - i've been wondering if devout christian scientists can refuse to offer any health insurance whatsoever. and whether jehovah's witnesses can exclude coverage for transfusions.

The religious views of one very rich, very right wing family is now settled law. The court came to this 5/4 decision on the basis of such high legal argumentation as birth control harms women because men will only want them "for the satisfaction of [their] own desires" and that contraception leads to "the maximization of sexual activity".

All bets are off and anything goes. Corporations need only assert a "sincerely held religious belief." There was a time when slavery and segregation was justified by some as God's will and codified into civil law. Now the intellectual progeny of the slaveholder and the segregationist are back in charge and playing the same game, so who knows what to expect?

I wonder; if the religious rights of corporate owners, directors and officers are inseparable from the corporations they control, then surely they have waived their rights to be personally shielded from responsibility for corporate financial liabilities and malfeasance, no?

There is no end to this.

[shiny!]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

re "conscience rights" and hobby lobby - i've been wondering if devout christian scientists can refuse to offer any health insurance whatsoever. and whether jehovah's witnesses can exclude coverage for transfusions.

I've wondered the same thing, e.g. can an employer refuse to pay for routine circumcision if it violates their religion?

[jk]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

re "conscience rights" and hobby lobby - i've been wondering if devout christian scientists can refuse to offer any health insurance whatsoever. and whether jehovah's witnesses can exclude coverage for transfusions.

[vinoveri]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

Warren already has the base of the left and she would do well if she stuck to economic policies, attacked FIRE and corporatocracy, and thereby appealled to a wider swath of middle and lower classes, and leave the gender identify, gay marriage, global warming stuff alone - still can't fault her for being honest about her priorities, which unfortunately have occupied the leftist agenda for the past 40 years while the middle and working classes were sold out by both parties. Still, watching her debate ms Clinton would be quite entertaining as well as revealing

http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com...mandments.html

"We believe in science, and that means that we have a responsibility to protect
this Earth." Global warming
"We believe that the Internet shouldn't be rigged to benefit big corporations,
and that means real net neutrality." REgulation of the Internet

"We believe that equal means equal, and that's true in marriage, it's true in
the workplace, it's true in all of America." Gay marriage
"And we believe that corporations are not people, that women have a right to
their bodies. We will overturnHobby
Lobby and we will fight for it. We will fight for it!" no conscience rights

[lektrode]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

Is it really going to generate that much revenue???....

well... of course it will, cb - for the construction cronies - who are just beginning to get fattened-up by another 'little project' (the local comments on this one are priceless ;) and will be in prime shape for some.... uhhhhh... donations - that and the davis-bacon guys who actually WORK on building it and dont fergit the patronage perps - aka, The Usual Suspects...

when is the last time you added a presidential library to your travel itinerary? and my wife and I are history buffs.... might stop into the Obama library if .... but it will not draw me to...

well.. thats beside the point - but some seem to think it WILL BE a tourist attraction and by the sounds of the 'grand design' it'll be right up there with the 'other 7' wonders of the world...

[charliebrown]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

Is it really going to generate that much revenue??? when is the last time you added a presidential library to your travel itinerary? and my wife and I are history buffs. I did stop by Ronald Reagan's and Herbert Hoovers boyhood homes, but these are close and on the way to something else. They had no or limited entry fee's and did not cost 100M. I might stop into the Obama library if in Hawaii, if i ever go then again, but it will not draw me to Hawaii. I would not spend a lot either. Like other "top line" attractions in the city I'm not going to spend $20 a person for this. Libraries are quickly converting content to on line content that can be viewed on a tablet.

[lektrode]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

Gvt funded clinics to take care of no brainer med stuff, shots, maintenance meds, casting, stiching etc.
Education bare bones that you could get a college degree for 10K year????
Take all the props out of housing. tax breaks, fannie, freddy etc.

Also add taxes to that and we don't have to artificially increase the minimum wage to make it a living wage. This also goes for state and local taxes too, which are usually much more regressive than federal income taxes.

+1
HEAR here!!!
'providing' some REAL COMPETITION to the existing med-ins-drug-legal mob-run scam - and i know this might sound like a joke - considering recent events (and fallguy/scapegoating) - but having the VA run these clinics would make the most sense, as the existing admin 'infrastructure' is already in place - as i've mentioned in the past, these clinics could be staffed by those who want to be educated in the med fields and would ENLIST in what could be a 6th branch of the services called The Medical Corps - they'd get 4-6years of ed on Uncle's dime and then OWE THE REST OF US an equal amount of SERVICE

The state of Ill says it is broke, yet can caugh up 100M for the presidential library.

heh - the ole horse-trading/race is on - and you can fill-in/swap where-evahs for 'all the benefits' (flowing mostly to the construction cronies and patronage perps)

“The Obama Presidential Center would bring transformative benefits to ......." said in a statement. “The pronounced economic impact would benefit ........ through out-of-state funding for the design and construction of the project and local job creation, not to mention the long term benefits of enhanced public education, a boost for the visitor industry and launching programs that will improve lives in ..... and around the world.”

at this rate of hype, curing the common cold and flatulence will be added to the list any day now...

but the game winner may already have been decided - CHI.towne style....

even if 'the competition' is heating up and being targeted and dealt with in the same way the teaparty types have been....

;)

[vt]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

You missed the point. This is not about any politician rebuilding anything; they are totally incapable.

But to say "You didn't build that" shows no understanding of what does grow an economy and create jobs.
Only entrepreneurs, and business men and women can grow an economy; failures occur.

[Slimprofits]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

None of them have any idea how to rebuild the economy to increase the middle class and create jobs.

Nor should we expect a politician, any politician, or any human at all for that matter, to know how to "rebuild the economy".

I can't think of a more unrealistic starting point.

[charliebrown]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

If you can achieve those 3 things, I think the US would be heading in a good direction...very closely followed by the previously mentioned need(I believe by EJ a couple months back) to promote policy that would make housing/education/health care more affordable.

Gvt funded clinics to take care of no brainer med stuff, shots, maintenance meds, casting, stiching etc.
Education bare bones that you could get a college degree for 10K year????
Take all the props out of housing. tax breaks, fannie, freddy etc.

Also add taxes to that and we don't have to artificially increase the minimum wage to make it a living wage. This also goes for state and local taxes too, which are usually much more regressive than federal income taxes.


The state of Ill says it is broke, yet can caugh up 100M for the presidential library.

[touhy]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

They should get out of the way of the economy, not build it (They would need to actual build things and hire people-most would not have a clue)

I note that Ms. Warren appears a supporter of the inport-export bank. I'm guessing she is a crony insider. Her pedigree would suggest it. She does have her populist talking points down though.

[lakedaemonian]

Re: While Clinton Offers a Resume, Warren Offers a Plan

None of the known, talked about candidates of either party have any appeal.

None of them have any idea how to rebuild the economy to increase the middle class and create jobs.

Couldn't agree more.