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Stock market falls 372 points, gold back over $900. Another ho-hum day at the government run casino

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  • Stock market falls 372 points, gold back over $900. Another ho-hum day at the government run casino

    Stock market falls 372 points, gold back over $900. Another ho-hum day at the government run casino

    Gold and oil investors on the other side of the trade roared back after cowering in the corner for a few weeks after the US Treasury, the Bank of Japan and a few other friends of the Fed ganged up on the short financials/long commodities trade popular among the world's hedge funds, desperate to protect their clients' wealth from the ravages of currency value destruction. That intervention sent oil and gold tumbling, but with the prospect of an exchange of a trillion bonars for a pile of now worthless high-concept securities, the trade is back with a vengeance.

    Over the weekend our Finance Minister Hank Paulson poured out promises of a quick fix and return to "normal" – endless asset price inflation and over-consumption funded by it. All it will cost is the next generation’s savings on top of the current generation’s already committed.

    In for a penny in for a dollar.

    Yesterday our Congress shocked us not only by showing up for work but showing the audacity to step up to – gasp! – ask questions about the Treasury's power grab. Here on C-SPAN, US Congressman Peter DeFazio puts on a rousing Mr. Smith Goes to Washington performance. The golden key is a nice touch.




    For the first time since this crisis started in the spring of 2007 Congress pushed back on our Finance Minister’s demands. If not directly confronting or even doubting they at least wondered aloud why we need allow him and his unknown successors and assorted minions to do whatever they deem necessary for a period of two years, at the pleasure of the secretary’s office, to return the US financial system to its rightful place as the world’s most deep and transparent, even as the veneer of trust flakes off to reveal shallowness and opacity. As Marshall McLuhan once said, "Mud sometimes gives the illusion of depth."

    One US representative reared up on his hind legs to suggest that perhaps, just maybe, the Minister might recuse himself from these proceedings as his former employer is counted among the now very limited two item menu of investment banks remaining of a 150 year tradition of capitalism in America, Goldman Sacks and JP Morgan, all other competitors now summarily wiped out. Also, and, well, gee (and – gosh) while we're on the subject, they aren't even investment banks anymore. The Fed on Monday made the two winners of the US Investment Bank Survivor Show – presto! – into bank holding companies so that they may swallow what is left of the assets of 1,000 or so bank failures, as estimated by reliable sources, waiting in the wings.

    Is that, you know, like, constitutional?

    Last time this happened, after the Savings & Loan fiasco, the government created the Resolution Trust Corporation so that any value that might possibly be recovered in the assets of those Frankenstein creations of deregulation and corruption stood a chance of recapture by tax payers, to minimize the damage. Fair value for those assets was assured by their sale on the open market. Not this time. We may never know what Goldman and JP Morgan will in the future pay for the assets that they are now politically lined up to receive at a discount. Of course, the truth is that most of the securitized debt is completely worthless – so should we complain that any value they might have will be snagged by private banks behind closed doors?

    Too late now. Instead of decision making authority Congress will demand transparency, dutiful reporting of decisions after the fact.

    Transparency. There’s a word I’d like to see banished from the finance lexicon. Let’s replace it with a venerable yet less popular word: honesty.

    Enron was transparent. It provided all of the data it was asked for in unfathomable volumes and right on time. US accounting firms with once honored names swore by them.

    But they were all lying.

    Can Secretary Paulson be trusted? Maybe so or maybe not. But if Congress passes this measure to give him even a fraction of the power he is asking for, they may as well cancel the upcoming presidential election in the same vote.

    It won’t matter anyway.

    iTulip Select subscribers can read our extensive analysis published today on the possibility and implications of capital and currency price controls in:
    US exchange rate and capital controls or bust?
    September 23, 2008, iTulip

    When inflows become outflows: Avoiding the Sudden Stop at the end of the multi-decade long American capital flow bonanza.

    Moreover, it may well be asked whether we can take it for granted that a return to freedom of exchanges is really a question of time. Even if the reply were in the affirmative, it is safe to assume that after a period of freedom the regime of control will be restored as a result of the next economic crisis.
    —Paul Einzig, Exchange Control, MacMillan and Company, 1934

    Exchange rate and capital controls are viewed by our modern economics orthodoxy as the retrograde policy of desperate third world countries that can’t hack free markets. However, history teaches us to not discount the possibility that major economies even in our current times may use them as a last resort. Each day the front page of the newspaper is plastered with reports of one last resort measure after another. It’s time to give the possibility of exchange rate and currency controls serious consideration. More ($ Subscription) …
    iTulip Select: The Investment Thesis for the Next Cycle™
    __________________________________________________

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    Last edited by FRED; September 23, 2008, 11:09 PM.

  • #2
    Re: Stock market falls 372. Ho, hum.







    http://www.NowAndTheFuture.com

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Stock market falls 372. Ho, hum.

      why do I feel so damn helpless watching htis happen? I don't even live in the US. Protest outside FOX news or something americans, millions of you! make sure you're heard.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Stock market falls 372. Ho, hum.

        Ok, Nationalization doesn't work. Communism next.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Stock market falls 372. Ho, hum.

          I think barts right, it's fascism. Everyone is bowing to the power of those in control of the printing press, they know nothing else....I don't either actually but gold or commodity based currency and zero interest loans sounds a whole lot better to me. Of course the most powerful people in the world will no longer be so in such a world so its a rather large obstacle to overcome.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Stock market falls 372. Ho, hum.

            I thought I was way out on the fringe, but apparently not any more.

            EJ - I challenge you to put this thread on the front page, with bart's first graphic. Let's call it what it is - the first stages of a fascist coup d'etat.

            Respectfully,

            t
            It's Economics vs Thermodynamics. Thermodynamics wins.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Stock market falls 372 points, gold back over $900. Another ho-hum day at the government run cas

              Well, Ron Paul said Congress ought to go home

              http://itulip.com/forums/showthread.php?t=5274

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Stock market falls 372. Ho, hum.

                Originally posted by EJ View Post
                Stock market falls 372, gold back over $900. Ho, hum.


                Today our Congress not only shocked us by showing up for work but had the audacity to step up to an assistant's job and – gasp! – ask questions!

                For the first time since this crisis started Congress pushed back on our Finance Minister’s demands. If not directly confronting or even doubting they at least wondered aloud why we need allow him and his unknown successors and assorted minions to do whatever they deem necessary, at the pleasure of the secretary’s office, to return the US financial system to its rightful place as the world’s pre-eminent, even as the veneer of market depth and transparency flakes off to reveal its true shallowness and opacity.
                Keep in mind EJ that if the 2006 elections had turned out the way they did from 2000-2004 we wouldn't even be having this discussion. The Rubber stamp congress of the same party that handed over it's powers to the executive branch would have enacted Paulsons plan behind closed doors and the money pumps to the big banks would be pumping full speed.

                I agree with you that the transition to a new economy is now underway whether we like it or not. But we should remember that what we transition into is yet to be determined, and the Executive-legislative-judicial branches will play a big part in where we end up.

                A congress that pushes back is a step forward from one that doesn't. The American public through neglecting it's responsibilities to be informed citizens, have given us a government of laissez faire robber barons that worked against it's own people. But it is not a government that we MUST have, it's a government grown from the seeds of ignorance.

                The ballot box may be one of the few tools we will have at our disposal to help reduce the pain of the transition period and to form a new economy that will be reasonably fair, honest, and sustainable. I think we need to be careful not to let our current despair lead us to abandon one of the few tools we have to maybe help get us to a place where we have a chance to build something better. If we let this transition be determined by the same people who gave us the current system, then the America we end up will be the America we deserve.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Stock market falls 372 points, gold back over $900. Another ho-hum day at the government run cas

                  They really are desperate, aren't they? Obviously the thought of total control is just too tempting to resist:

                  Paulson and Bernanke urge approval of bail-out

                  By James Politi in Washington
                  Published: September 23 2008 13:58 | Last updated: September 23 2008 13:58

                  Hank Paulson, US treasury secretary, and Ben Bernanke, chairman of the Federal Reserve, on Tuesday urged Congress to rapidly approve their $700bn government intervention to rescue the US financial system from collapse.
                  In remarks released ahead of a hearing before legislators on the Senate banking committee, Mr Paulson defended the plan, saying it would “avoid a series of financial institution failures and frozen credit markets that threaten American families’ financial well-being, the viability of businesses both small and large, and the very health of our economy.”

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Stock market falls 372 points, gold back over $900. Another ho-hum day at the government run cas

                    If anyone thinks the Demopublican side of the coin isn't nostrils deep in this cesspool with the Republicrat side (or MSNBC/CNN with Sux News),
                    emphatically including Dahack Odamnit(see whose written him the biggest
                    campaign checks), then I've got some lovely CDS paper I'd be happy to
                    let you have, for a song(probably one from Metallica or Black Sabbath, tho).

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Stock market falls 372 points, gold back over $900. Another ho-hum day at the government run cas

                      Originally posted by Rantly McTirade View Post
                      If anyone thinks the Demopublican side of the coin isn't nostrils deep in this cesspool with the Republicrat side (or MSNBC/CNN with Sux News),
                      emphatically including Dahack Odamnit(see whose written him the biggest
                      campaign checks), then I've got some lovely CDS paper I'd be happy to
                      let you have, for a song(probably one from Metallica or Black Sabbath, tho).
                      MY Sentiments Exactly Rantly!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Stock market falls 372. Ho, hum.

                        Originally posted by *T* View Post
                        I thought I was way out on the fringe, but apparently not any more.

                        EJ - I challenge you to put this thread on the front page, with bart's first graphic. Let's call it what it is - the first stages of a fascist coup d'etat.

                        Respectfully,

                        t
                        Y'all (Bart, marvenger, and T) need to find a different word for what this is, because "fascist" means something else:
                        Fascism is a totalitarian nationalist political ideology and mass movement that is concerned with notions of cultural decline or decadence, and which seeks to achieve a millenarian national rebirth by exalting the nation or race, as well as promoting cults of unity, strength and purity.

                        The reason you need to find another word is because -- like any reference to Hitler or the Nazis -- you immediately dilute and discredit your message the moment you resort to the f-word for any political development of which you do not approve.

                        You are right about the statist undertones of a further power grab by the executive, but you are all kinds of wrong -- and rhetorically lazy to boot -- to use that word for this circumstance.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Stock market falls 372. Ho, hum.

                          Your tinfoil is not working, bart.
                          Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend. Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read. -Groucho

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Stock market falls 372. Ho, hum.

                            What about corporativism?

                            http://www.opednews.com/articles/ope...cism_2c_th.htm


                            Originally posted by ASH View Post

                            The reason you need to find another word is because ...

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Stock market falls 372 points, gold back over $900. Another ho-hum day at the government run cas

                              Painting these events in a broad historical brush I think we are witnessing Capitalism in its purest form. As Marx would say, unfettered. Mercantile Capitalism transforming into Production Capitalism transforming into Finance Capitalism.

                              In the 20th Century Capitalism was fettered by class conflicts it didn't always win. Following WW2 not only was Capitalism's Big Kahuna stalemated by organized labor but it had a global rival system to contend with, hence Capitalism With A Human Face.

                              Those fetters have been decisively broken.

                              Looking at history as a guide to the future, when a system reaches a point of historical purity it usually means the next historical epoch is about to emerge. It's usually a big surprise. If we're around long enough, I guess we'll see.

                              Comment

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