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Is Obama our Gorbachev?

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  • Is Obama our Gorbachev?

    Was talking with a friend today who was asking how Paulson, Geither would be thought of ten years from now. I said they'd be remembered for trying to reboot a failed system.

    Then I casually said "Obama is our Gorbachev"

    And the more I thought about it, the more it made a weird kind of sense. Younger guy from a new generation trying to take a failed system and right it. But the he grew up as part of the system and can't recognize that it is a failure at this point (which needs revamping to a level that it wouldn't be recognizable anymore as the old system) or the bureaucracy and entrenched interests won't *let* the required changes happen (or fight it so long both sides are exhausted and die on the battlefield)

  • #2
    Re: Is Obama our Gorbachev?

    i'd like to think you're right. but i'm beginning to think that obama is our brezhnev. brezhnev displaced the erratic krushchev and made the soviet union safe for entrenched elites.

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    • #3
      Re: Is Obama our Gorbachev?

      Originally posted by jk View Post
      i'd like to think you're right. but i'm beginning to think that obama is our brezhnev. brezhnev displaced the erratic krushchev and made the soviet union safe for entrenched elites.
      Yeesh....horrible thought.

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      • #4
        Re: Is Obama our Gorbachev?

        Originally posted by jk View Post
        i'd like to think you're right. but i'm beginning to think that obama is our brezhnev. brezhnev displaced the erratic krushchev and made the soviet union safe for entrenched elites.
        The difference is that unlike Brezhnev, Obama eventually has to go to the polls...

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        • #5
          Re: Is Obama our Gorbachev?

          Originally posted by GRG55 View Post
          The difference is that unlike Brezhnev, Obama eventually has to go to the polls...

          yes, he'll be running against a republican chernenko. [if we're lucky, and it's not a republican stalin.]

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          • #6
            Re: Is Obama our Gorbachev?

            Originally posted by jpatter666 View Post
            Was talking with a friend today who was asking how Paulson, Geither would be thought of ten years from now. I said they'd be remembered for trying to reboot a failed system.

            Then I casually said "Obama is our Gorbachev"

            And the more I thought about it, the more it made a weird kind of sense. Younger guy from a new generation trying to take a failed system and right it. But the he grew up as part of the system and can't recognize that it is a failure at this point (which needs revamping to a level that it wouldn't be recognizable anymore as the old system) or the bureaucracy and entrenched interests won't *let* the required changes happen (or fight it so long both sides are exhausted and die on the battlefield)
            I just now caught this post. I said essentially the same thing in a post just a while back.

            Confirming Parallel (near) simultaneous independent conclusions are not to be trifled with.

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            • #7
              Re: Is Obama our Gorbachev?

              Originally posted by jk View Post
              yes, he'll be running against a republican chernenko. [if we're lucky, and it's not a republican stalin.]
              Did you mean Palin?:eek:

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              • #8
                Re: Is Obama our Gorbachev?

                Originally posted by jtabeb View Post
                Did you mean Palin?:eek:
                somewhere recently i read a quote of upton sinclair, that when fascism comes to america it will be wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross.

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                • #9
                  Re: Is Obama our Gorbachev?

                  Well that leaves out "biker leather" Palin then...[insert sound of sigh of relief here]...

                  Last edited by GRG55; 04-17-10, 12:09 PM.

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                  • #10
                    Re: Is Obama our Gorbachev?

                    Originally posted by jtabeb View Post
                    I just now caught this post. I said essentially the same thing in a post just a while back.

                    Confirming Parallel (near) simultaneous independent conclusions are not to be trifled with.
                    I just caught this post as well. If President Obama is our Gorbachev, does that make Ahmadinejad the world's Reagan?
                    I can hear it now: "Mr. Obama, tear down this wall! Also, the Jews did 9/11."

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                    • #11
                      Re: Is Obama our Gorbachev?

                      Originally posted by jk View Post
                      somewhere recently i read a quote of upton sinclair, that when fascism comes to america it will be wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross.
                      That's the kind of nonsense that the elites have been using to destroy the traditional culture of Western Civilization now for sometime. Mostly, it's a variation of the "black legend" and is equally fallacious as 1) the conviction rate even at the height of the inquisition, or even with the Star Chamber, never has approached what is in the US today (well over 99%) 2) everything that defines civilization originated in countries that a) were highly nationalistic and b) Christian and 3) the leadership of the most oppressive regimes have at all times been primarily associated with atheists and/or non-Christian monotheists.

                      Regardless, fascism is at this point an epithet and has no meaning.

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                      • #12
                        Re: Is Obama our Gorbachev?

                        Originally posted by Serge_Tomiko View Post
                        2) everything that defines civilization originated in countries that a) were highly nationalistic and b) Christian and 3) the leadership of the most oppressive regimes have at all times been primarily associated with atheists and/or non-Christian monotheists.
                        And THAT's the kind of nonsense that put you on my ignore list. Dude are you trolling or are you serious?
                        It's Economics vs Thermodynamics. Thermodynamics wins.

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                        • #13
                          Re: Is Obama our Gorbachev?

                          I don't think Gorby is the right analogy. Yes, there are some parallels such as the new generation trying to right a failing model but the BIG difference is that Gorbachev was a hapless sad sack sort of like Carter who let himself get overwhelmed by events and when faced with a more forceful opponent (Reagan), let the system collapse.

                          Obama is no Gorbachev or Carter. He may be going down the wrong path but he is in no way letting events control his destiny. He is highly adept politically and more than willing to ignore dissent and crack heads when necessary to get his way.

                          Perhaps a better historical analogy would be a Napoleon. Very driven with a stunning amount of short term successes but headed to disaster due to hubris.
                          Greg

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                          • #14
                            Re: Is Obama our Gorbachev?

                            Originally posted by BiscayneSunrise View Post
                            ... but headed to disaster due to hubris.
                            hubris, or psychopathology?
                            Most folks are good; a few aren't.

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                            • #15
                              Re: Is Obama our Gorbachev?

                              Originally posted by *T* View Post
                              And THAT's the kind of nonsense that put you on my ignore list. Dude are you trolling or are you serious?
                              The sentence I wrote should be rewritten to say "modern civilization".

                              Anyway, I'm terribly sorry to offend your politically correct notions. You can go back to practicing usury and living off whatever fat is left in that shell of the British Empire.

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