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  • #46
    Re: Britian going to the Polls

    Originally posted by GRG55 View Post
    You appear to be conflating a binary referendum with a multi-party election?

    Everyone knows the Brexit Party is a single issue entity. How confident do you think the voters are that this Party is actually able, or even interested, in dealing with all the other issues of governing. I thought it was pretty clear in my earlier post that this would be one of their prime motivations to ally with the pro-Brexit Conservatives. Further their one cause, without having to campaign on any of the other responsibilities of governing.
    Well, let some facts burst through.

    "It was a tough night for both Labour and the Conservatives.The Brexit Party swept across Britain, and the Liberal Democrats and Green Party also made gains.
    The Brexit Party topped polls in every country or region apart from London, which was won by the Liberal Democrats; Scotland, which was won by the SNP; and Northern Ireland, where they did not stand.


    Again:

    "A DEMOCRATIC EARTHQUAKE

    The Brexit Party has already taken the country by storm and made history.

    In May 2019, barely six weeks after launching, we won the European elections with more votes than the Tory and Labour Parties combined. Our 29 MEPs make us the joint-biggest party in the European Parliament. We are the fastest-growing new party in modern history, having signed up more than 110,000 paying supporters within two months. We are a true peopleís party, dependent on supportersí donations. The meteoric rise of the Brexit Party has shaken the establishment parties to their core. But this is only the start. https://www.thebrexitparty.org/about/

    Comment


    • #47
      Re: Britian going to the Polls

      Originally posted by Chris Coles View Post
      Well, let some facts burst through.

      "It was a tough night for both Labour and the Conservatives.The Brexit Party swept across Britain, and the Liberal Democrats and Green Party also made gains.
      The Brexit Party topped polls in every country or region apart from London, which was won by the Liberal Democrats; Scotland, which was won by the SNP; and Northern Ireland, where they did not stand.


      Again:

      "A DEMOCRATIC EARTHQUAKE

      The Brexit Party has already taken the country by storm and made history.

      In May 2019, barely six weeks after launching, we won the European elections with more votes than the Tory and Labour Parties combined. Our 29 MEPs make us the joint-biggest party in the European Parliament. We are the fastest-growing new party in modern history, having signed up more than 110,000 paying supporters within two months. We are a true peopleís party, dependent on supportersí donations. The meteoric rise of the Brexit Party has shaken the establishment parties to their core. But this is only the start. https://www.thebrexitparty.org/about/

      Oh, Puleeeese.

      This is all about the European Parliament election. What does the Brexit Party have? 29 out 751 seats?
      The message Brits sent to both the EU and their own nearly deaf, non-functioning Parliament in that election was the same message that came out in the Brexit referendum.

      So let's suppose Brexit happens. Then what does the Brexit Party do? Farage retires (again), and the Party having achieved its defining objective fades to black.

      Comment


      • #48
        Re: Britian going to the Polls

        Originally posted by GRG55 View Post
        You appear to be conflating a binary referendum with a multi-party election?...
        I don't believe I am, but that's a fair criticism and time will tell.

        My point is simply that the blanket assertion "no chance at all" strikes me as a bit of whistling past the graveyard and particularly so in light of recent history.

        There are times when a single issue galvinates people to a point where it overshadows all other considerations. And when voters see that politicians and the elites they represent are unresponsive to their demands, dismissive of their interests, and downright hostile and indifferent to them, they don't consider matters of policy and governance in the same thoughtful and nuanced manner as perhaps they should.

        They instead throw up a middle finger in response to the same gesture they feel has been offered to them. And one has to wonder if that's more or less likely to happen in this instance.

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        • #49
          Re: Britian going to the Polls

          Meantime

          Comment


          • #50
            Re: Britian going to the Polls

            Originally posted by GRG55 View Post
            Oh, Puleeeese.

            This is all about the European Parliament election. What does the Brexit Party have? 29 out 751 seats?
            The message Brits sent to both the EU and their own nearly deaf, non-functioning Parliament in that election was the same message that came out in the Brexit referendum.

            So let's suppose Brexit happens. Then what does the Brexit Party do? Farage retires (again), and the Party having achieved its defining objective fades to black.
            You have not followed up on their primary aiming points for this election. Not sure if this link will work, but it did for me. When you scroll down the page you will find a video titled: 1 of 13 we are ready to tour and the page says not available yet. But if you look carefully at the top left there is an arrow to the right, click on that gives you the party launch video. That sets out what is coming down the line and it is very much more than Brexit or Nigel Farage. https://www.thebrexitparty.org/

            Essentially they are setting out to completely reform our parliamentary system, elected House of Lords, Brexit is a very small part of the offer; Farage is not the lead any more.

            Comment


            • #51
              Re: Britian going to the Polls

              Originally posted by GRG55 View Post
              Oh, Puleeeese.

              This is all about the European Parliament election. What does the Brexit Party have? 29 out 751 seats?
              The message Brits sent to both the EU and their own nearly deaf, non-functioning Parliament in that election was the same message that came out in the Brexit referendum.

              So let's suppose Brexit happens. Then what does the Brexit Party do? Farage retires (again), and the Party having achieved its defining objective fades to black.

              Originally posted by Chris Coles View Post
              You have not followed up on their primary aiming points for this election. Not sure if this link will work, but it did for me. When you scroll down the page you will find a video titled: 1 of 13 we are ready to tour and the page says not available yet. But if you look carefully at the top left there is an arrow to the right, click on that gives you the party launch video. That sets out what is coming down the line and it is very much more than Brexit or Nigel Farage. https://www.thebrexitparty.org/

              Essentially they are setting out to completely reform our parliamentary system, elected House of Lords, Brexit is a very small part of the offer; Farage is not the lead any more.
              Well, well. What a surprise.
              At the risk of sounding like a stuck CD I will repeat, the Brexit Party is a single issue party. This was the entirely predictable outcome if it wished to remain relevant in any capacity after the Dec 12 election.

              https://www.bbc.com/news/election-2019-50377396
              General election 2019: Brexit Party will not stand in Tory seats

              11 minutes ago

              The Brexit Party has announced that it will not stand candidates in the 317 seats won by the Conservatives at the 2017 general election.

              Party leader Nigel Farage said standing candidates across the country could increase the chances of another EU referendum taking place.

              But he said the party would stand against all other parties - and focus on taking seats off Labour...


              Last edited by GRG55; 11-11-19, 08:37 AM.

              Comment


              • #52
                Re: Britian going to the Polls

                Originally posted by GRG55 View Post
                Well, well. What a surprise.
                At the risk of sounding like a stuck CD I will repeat, the Brexit Party is a single issue party. This was the entirely predictable outcome if it wished to remain relevant in any capacity after the Dec 12 election.

                https://www.bbc.com/news/election-2019-50377396
                General election 2019: Brexit Party will not stand in Tory seats

                11 minutes ago

                The Brexit Party has announced that it will not stand candidates in the 317 seats won by the Conservatives at the 2017 general election.

                Party leader Nigel Farage said standing candidates across the country could increase the chances of another EU referendum taking place.

                But he said the party would stand against all other parties - and focus on taking seats off Labour...


                Well I would not like to disappoint you, but I still believe the BREXIT party have much more going for them than it would seem to anyone outside of the UK.

                Again, the decision today was obvious from the moment that all the remain parties decided to work together, and I for one believe that Nigel Farage had no choice. He has been running up and down the nation taking the temperature of many diverse communities, and that will also have given him a clear view of where he should target his efforts. It takes real leadership to admit a need to change direction, and then follow through and do it. So he gets my full support and I wish him well.

                Once the remain parties decided to gang together; he had no choice but to concede a full on election. My thoughts are also with all those candidates that have to step back and wait.

                Comment


                • #53
                  Re: Britian going to the Polls

                  Originally posted by Chris Coles View Post
                  ...Once the remain parties decided to gang together; he had no choice but to concede a full on election. My thoughts are also with all those candidates that have to step back and wait.
                  Looks like Farage made the right move after all. The Brexit Party has hammered Labour all over the country, particularly in Leave areas but down in Remain areas too. His standing down changed the election completely and it's arguable that Farage showed skillful leadership by putting country ahead of ego. It's still early in the count, but there's no doubt that the British people still back Brexit and donít want a second referendum. Justified or not, the price of ignoring the 2016 vote is being paid by Jeremy Corbyn tonight. Traditional Labour heartlands are falling, some they have held since the 20's and some are electing their first Tory MPs ever. So far, it's looking like the biggest Conservative victory since 1987 and Labour's worst showing since 1935. When the dust settles, it might well be that the damage done to Labour was at the hands of the Brexit Party. Farage and his party may be a footnote in British political history, but he is the main figure responsible for catalysing support for Brexit. The Brexit Party has clearly played a massive role in reducing Labour votes and seats and altering the course of British political history. It appears Nigel is well on his way to seeing his mission completed.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Re: Britian going to the Polls

                    this WAS the 2nd referendum.

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Re: Britian going to the Polls

                      Originally posted by Woodsman View Post
                      Looks like Farage made the right move after all. The Brexit Party has hammered Labour all over the country, particularly in Leave areas but down in Remain areas too. His standing down changed the election completely and it's arguable that Farage showed skillful leadership by putting country ahead of ego. It's still early in the count, but there's no doubt that the British people still back Brexit and donít want a second referendum. Justified or not, the price of ignoring the 2016 vote is being paid by Jeremy Corbyn tonight. Traditional Labour heartlands are falling, some they have held since the 20's and some are electing their first Tory MPs ever. So far, it's looking like the biggest Conservative victory since 1987 and Labour's worst showing since 1935. When the dust settles, it might well be that the damage done to Labour was at the hands of the Brexit Party. Farage and his party may be a footnote in British political history, but he is the main figure responsible for catalysing support for Brexit. The Brexit Party has clearly played a massive role in reducing Labour votes and seats and altering the course of British political history. It appears Nigel is well on his way to seeing his mission completed.
                      While in part you are correct to cite the Brexit party, my belief is that one man has destroyed the credibility of the Labour Party; Hillary Benn. Yes, his constituents still voted him back in, yes, with a reduced majority; but his actions during the debates towards the end of the last Parliament were disastrous, not just for the Labour Party, but for the whole concept of democracy. In my most humble opinion, Hillary Benn is the, no; THE; most dangerous individual in the United Kingdom. Period!

                      Again, Jeremy Corbyn was thus left with a stark choice; if he stood up as a full on leaver, the Benn tribe were going to destroy him before the election ever took place. As it was, Corbyn did a remarkable job of ensuring that the leave vote won the election and to my way of thinking, he will be, silently, happy with the result.

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Re: Britian going to the Polls

                        ......................................he will be delighted by the result

                        Benn?
                        Ah yes I recall his Father well, the man who drove British Leyland into the ground (with help from the Marxist unions) along with a very large chunk of British manufacturing.
                        For ever my late Father thought the World of Benn, I was brought up that way as well......until one day I heard him talking about "Radio Caroline", the private priate radio station.

                        He wanted to send the Navy in, he didn't like "Pop" music......& as for young people expressing their own open thoughts (that might not be Marxist) No No No!!!!!

                        This "Freedom fighter" was happy to fight for HIS freedom, not mine.

                        The Sad fail to dump Benn is VERY bad news, and sadly we lost Caroline Flint (1st time Labour lost the seat since 1924!)

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Re: Britian going to the Polls

                          Originally posted by Woodsman View Post
                          Looks like Farage made the right move after all. The Brexit Party has hammered Labour all over the country, particularly in Leave areas but down in Remain areas too. His standing down changed the election completely and it's arguable that Farage showed skillful leadership by putting country ahead of ego. It's still early in the count, but there's no doubt that the British people still back Brexit and donít want a second referendum. Justified or not, the price of ignoring the 2016 vote is being paid by Jeremy Corbyn tonight. Traditional Labour heartlands are falling, some they have held since the 20's and some are electing their first Tory MPs ever. So far, it's looking like the biggest Conservative victory since 1987 and Labour's worst showing since 1935. When the dust settles, it might well be that the damage done to Labour was at the hands of the Brexit Party. Farage and his party may be a footnote in British political history, but he is the main figure responsible for catalysing support for Brexit. The Brexit Party has clearly played a massive role in reducing Labour votes and seats and altering the course of British political history. It appears Nigel is well on his way to seeing his mission completed.
                          You can't be serious? The Brexit Party was almost completely irrelevant at the polls. They took 2% of the popular vote, 642,303 ballots. Even the Green Party did better than that.

                          The voters may have backed Brexit, but they sure didn't back the Brexit Party. This was a total disaster for Nigel Farage, as he has no ability to influence whatever deal BoJo may decide to cut with the Europeans. Remember, he was objecting to the deal BoJo was waving around just prior to the dropping of the writ.

                          Gotta admit, BoJo's line in his post-election speech about the UK becoming "Corbyn neutral" was pretty funny.
                          Last edited by GRG55; 12-14-19, 12:39 AM.

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                          • #58
                            Re: Britian going to the Polls

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Re: Britian going to the Polls

                              Drink deeply from the Well of nothingless

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                              • #60
                                Re: Britian going to the Polls



                                Sorry for Caroline, nice honest woman......sunk by a metro-libs

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