To President Obama : from Europe with Love

[hellstan]

Mister :cool: President,

After this long night, staying up, following this not-so-nerve wrecking run to victory,
we just wished to share this moment with you and the people of America.
Your historical election, and the first speech you gave as new president elect moved us
and the world to the core, deep in what we (still) believe in.
Congratulations to you, and congratulations to the Americans, to this country, which hopefully will revive -
and the world with it.

For the first time since decades, you already inspire millions to work
for getting out of the dire straits the world is entering in.
We couldn't dream a more reasonable and willful guide
in this enterprise.

Hopefully, America will be back.

Long live your presidency,;)
Johan Frederik Hel Guedj (and some others)

[labasta]

Mister :cool: President,

After this long night, staying up, following this not-so-nerve wrecking run to victory,
we just wished to share this moment with you and the people of America.
Your historical election, and the first speech you gave as new president elect moved us
and the world to the core, deep in what we (still) believe in.
Congratulations to you, and congratulations to the Americans, to this country, which hopefully will revive -
and the world with it.

For the first time since decades, you already inspire millions to work
for getting out of the dire straits the world is entering in.
We couldn't dream a more reasonable and willful guide
in this enterprise.

Hopefully, America will be back.

Long live your presidency,;)
Johan Frederik Hel Guedj (and some others)



actions speak louder than words.

Let's not give him Messiah status just yet.

[hellstan]

actions speak louder than words.

Let's not give him Messiah status just yet.

Since logos took up this Earth (about 2700 years),
words shape the world.

PS : After 8 years of illiteracy, the "first African-American who is bright and articulate"
sounds like a Messiah, for some. That says a lot about how dumb Double-dWarf made
us all.

[tsetsefly]

The reaction over obama's election is truly embarrassing to watch.

I want to see after 2 years of recession if he is still God's gift to earth... as for his policies, I still don't know how they are so different than the rest of democrats, what radical change is he going to bring??? :rolleyes:

[hellstan]

The reaction over obama's election is truly embarrassing to watch.

I want to see after 2 years of recession if he is still God's gift to earth... as for his policies, I still don't know how they are so different than the rest of democrats, what radical change is he going to bring??? :rolleyes:

In democracy, chronic pessimism is even more embarrassing.
In democracy, bitterness leads to rant, and rant leads to populism.
We had 8 years of that. And, what's more, a mediocre flavour of it.
Didn't have nausea ?

[metalman]

In democracy, pessimism is even more embarrassing.
In democracy, bitterness leads to rant, and rant leads to populism.
We had 8 years of that. And, what's more, a mediocre flavour of it.
Didn't have nausea ?

we're all reeling from the lovely prospect of obama making good on his robin hood promises... steal from the boomers to give to the gen-x & gen-we generation who elected him. looks like we're gonna have to pay our own debts. dern.

well, maybe not...

http://itulip.com/forums/showthread.php?p=59065#post59065

[hellstan]

we're all reeling from the lovely prospect of obama making good on his robin hood promises... steal from the boomers to give to the gen-x & gen-we generation who elected him. looks like we're gonna have to pay our own debts. dern.

well, maybe not...

http://itulip.com/forums/showthread.php?p=59065#post59065

Well, after 8 years of a faux Jesse James ("bring'em on")
escorted by a bunch of Philip Francis Queeg and led by B series
Citizen Kanes (without Rosebud), a bit of
Robin Hood (or is it just sound principles of the US
Constitution revived, at last) gives me a bowl of fresh air. :rolleyes:

[metalman]

Well, after 8 years of a faux Jesse James ("bring'em on")
escorted by a bunch of Philip Francis Queeg and led by B series
Citizen Kanes (without Rosebud), a bit of
Robin Hood (or is it just sound principles of the US
Constitution revived, at last) gives me a bowl of fresh air. :rolleyes:

those of us ron paul suppotrers who voted for obama did so for complicated reasons unlike the gen-x types.

the choices when bush was elected, if you recall, we're great. not even a ron paul for encouragement.

i held my nose to vote for gore. i hate gore nearly as much as i hate kerry, but not as much as i feared bush.

i'm more optimistic about obama because when it comes to campaigns what you see is what you get... a sloppy and stupid campaign = sloppy and stupid administration. that's the #1 reason mcacain lost. if obama had also run a sloppy campaign like hillary's it'd have been a tougher choice. but obama's was a tight campaign... tight as a drum. his administration will be likewise. he'll get things done. some of it will be good and some of it bad. we shall see.

he needs a test of fire right out of the gate... Russia Warns of New Missile Deployment (http://www.nytimes.com/2008/11/06/world/europe/06russia.html?em)

what will obama do? back down from don putin and his puppet and throw us allies under the bus?

[hellstan]

Well, last time a rookie got a major test right out of the gate, it was JFK with the Bay of Pigs. But the Bay of Pigs was timed bomb left by Ike under the
chair of his successor - without telling him a word about it.
So the rookie botched the first test.
But he did first class in the second : missiles crisis.

Obama has got something you may feel right on TV - no need to have him in front of you. He exsudes authority. (You may take my word for it - I've met some bosses in my life.)
That might be useful, for a US president.

[bart]

Food for thought - the fireside chat tradition:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fireside_chat

[tsetsefly]

In democracy, chronic pessimism is even more embarrassing.
In democracy, bitterness leads to rant, and rant leads to populism.
We had 8 years of that. And, what's more, a mediocre flavour of it.
Didn't have nausea ?
Well the US is suppose to be a republic not a rule of the majority (democracy).
IT hasnt been a republic for some time but just pointing it out...

I did not vote for Obama but preferred him over Mccain. I was tired of the republicans representing capitalism and free-markets in the eye's of everyone. When we know their not even close to that.

At least when Obama screws up they cant blame capitalism.

Obama has good leadership qualities no doubt about that. I also think he is a Clinton like politician, meaning he will not want to go to extreme to appease everyone. Might be wrong on that call though.

I actually fear polosi more, who knows what she and her senate will try to pass....

[hellstan]

tsetsefly (http://www.itulip.com/forums/member.php?u=11784) http://www.itulip.com/forums/images/statusicon/user_online.gif <script type="text/javascript"> vbmenu_register("postmenu_59097", true); </script>
Junior iTuliper wrote :

Well the US is suppose to be a republic not a rule of the majority (democracy).
IT hasnt been a republic for some time but just pointing it out...

Right. But if all republic are not necessarily democracies, all democracies are republic.;)

At least when Obama screws up they cant blame capitalism.

Never heard him depart from capitalism, if words retain their meaning.
Besides, he did not privatize the benefits and nationalize the debts.
A Republican did.

Obama has good leadership qualities no doubt about that. I also think he is a Clinton like politician, meaning he will not want to go to extreme to appease everyone. Might be wrong on that call though.

Exactly. This guy is not extreme for a bit. That shows. He's a chess player. He thinks before acting, several moves in anticipation. He's an organizer. That's news, after 8 years of shooting without a second thought (or even a first).

I actually fear polosi more, who knows what she and her senate will try to pass....

I agree. She's light headed and might be dogmatic.

[BiscayneSunrise]

Obama , no doubt, made history yesterday. But the real history is not so much that he is the first minority to become US president but that he is now in the driver seat as the world is in the beginnings of a major historical inflection point.

With very secure majorities in Congress and with the prospect of appointing judges to his liking, Obama and the Democratic Party will effectively control all three branches of government. On day 1, Obama will have more power than most presidents can ever dream of having.

Obama campaigned on wanting to develop closer ties with our allies and being tougher on Iran, Pakistan and Afghanistan. (As an aside, in the eyes of Obama, our most important allies are west europe, or at least, they are the allies whose opinion matters the most.) If Obama is serious about being tough in Afghanistan, our west European allies may find it uncomfortable when Obama asks for greater military contribution. Along the same lines, he wants to be tough on Iran but pull troops out of Iraq. The two are mutually exclusive. A large military presence in the Gulf keeps pressure on the Iranians. As for keeping our other allies happy, the Saudi's are concerned with the Russian resurgence which means an alliance with iran and more meddling in the region. The saudi's very much want continued US presence in Iraq and the Gulf. A policy that makes one set of allies happy will likely make a different set of allies unhappy. The war in iraq pleased our Arab allies but upset our european allies. You can't please all of the people all of the time.

My point is Europe may be euphoric now about an Obama election but is is paramount to remember that they have very different interests than do the US. Witness, Angela Merkel cozying up to the Russians, suppliers of their energy.

In what is no doubt, not a coincidence, President Medved yesterday issued a challenge to US authority in Europe and announced new military expansion aimed at Europe. I wonder how fellow iTulipers from Europe feel about that? How will our allies in east Asia and the Mideast feel if we trade away their interests to hold off Russia. As someone on this thread mentioned Obama is a chess player, seeing several moves ahead. Well, the great game of geopolitics is exactly that, a chess game. I know a lot of people don't like the war in Iraq but in the chess game of global strategy, the US now holds a very significant strategic advantage in the mideast. The war in Iraq has been won, it is now just a matter of consolidating gains politically and diplomatically, we'll see if we can continue to so.

Obama is a master campaigner but he will likely find people like Putin, Merkel and Ahmedinejad not so amenable to his charisma. Joe Biden says Obama has a spine of steel and basically called out our enemies during the campaign. We will see.

[we_are_toast]

With very secure majorities in Congress and with the prospect of appointing judges to his liking, Obama and the Democratic Party will effectively control all three branches of government. On day 1, Obama will have more power than most presidents can ever dream of having.
Incorrect. The Supreme court is currently one of the most extreme right wing courts in the nations history. It will be many years and maybe not in Obama's terms that the court can be restored to it's historic balance.

The Republican party did more filibusters(62) in one year than any party in the history of the Republic. They will do their best to stop any progress the country tries to make.

So the road to recovery from the damage that the dark decades of extremest control of the government will be difficult. We can only hope that there are some Republican moderates that will put their country above their party loyalty.

[Judas]

Incorrect. The Supreme court is currently one of the most extreme right wing courts in the nations history. It will be many years and maybe not in Obama's terms that the court can be restored to it's historic balance.

I'm not sure I follow this.

Just recently the Supreme Court was just one vote away from removing the Second Amendment as an individual right, the Kelo case was devastating to private property rights in the face of the "communal good"/government revenues, race-based "affirmative action" discrimination in hiring and educational opportunities upheld, etc.

How does indicate an "extreme right wing" bias in the court?

[BiscayneSunrise]

Obama will likely have the opportunity to appoint one maybe even two Supreme court justices with a very friendly Senate vetting his choices. That along with the many dozens, even hundreds of open judicial seats will give Obama that opportunity to wield enormous influence across all three branches of government. I was not making a political statement just stating a fact.

Perhaps, make up of the judiciary is a moot point. As Obama said, in the recently publicized radio interview, he didn't think that the court system was inclined to push hard enough for the reforms he was most interested in. he admitted as a legislator himself, he thought the legislature was best positioned to advance major reforms. A legislature his party now controls.

To your point with just a couple of moderate Republicans, the Senate becomes filibuster proof.

The danger for Obama and Democrats is they must be careful not to fall into the same trap Bush fell into. Bush thought he had a mandate even with a slim margin of victory and marginalized his opponents. While Obama won a significant electoral victory, he still governs a divided country. He and Congressional leadership need to govern judiciously so as not to anger voters as happened to Clinton in 1994. It was a backlash to some of Clinton's policies that gave Republicans congressional control.

If Republican congressional opposition is de-fanged, then it will be interesting to note that there is another group of people in Washington who act as a check to government power. That is the lobbyists. Obama put together a very complicated coalition, many of whom have conflicting interests, i.e coal miners vs. greenies. It is likely these conflicts could continue to lock government action and that lobbyists could likely influence major decisions.

[grapejelly]

the traditional "right wing left wing" measurements are off base. There is "more government intervention" and "less government intervention" and Obama is like all presidents since Cleveland, in the "more" tradition.

Europe loves him because he is cosmopolitan, handsome, young, and quite socialist in what he has professed.

[Rajiv]

From Iowa
Obama Victory Speech 14 min


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to Denver
Obama acceptance speech 45 min


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to Washington
President-Elect Barack Obama Victory Speech (Full Video) 28 Min


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[BiscayneSunrise]

the traditional "right wing left wing" measurements are off base. There is "more government intervention" and "less government intervention" and Obama is like all presidents since Cleveland, in the "more" tradition.

Europe loves him because he is cosmopolitan, handsome, young, and quite socialist in what he has professed.

Exactly. it's not right or left, it's more or less personal freedoms. And we have been sliding to less personal freedoms since 9/11. Thomas Jefferson began the move towards more big government with the Louisiana purchase. he did it without congressional approval and dramatically expanded executive power. Ironically, Jefferson ran a campaign of smaller government. Does this sound familiar?

The problem with things like the Patriot Act and the bailout package is the Republicans made the mistake creating a huge government monster thinking they could trust themselves to manage it. The problem is that the so called trustworthy people won't always be in office but the laws remain on the books to potentially be abused by future leadership.

[KGW]

"In what is no doubt, not a coincidence, President Medved yesterday issued a challenge to US authority in Europe and announced new military expansion aimed at Europe. I wonder how fellow iTulipers from Europe feel about that? How will our allies in east Asia and the Mideast feel if we trade away their interests to hold off Russia. As someone on this thread mentioned Obama is a chess player, seeing several moves ahead. Well, the great game of geopolitics is exactly that, a chess game. I know a lot of people don't like the war in Iraq but in the chess game of global strategy, the US now holds a very significant strategic advantage in the mideast. The war in Iraq has been won, it is now just a matter of consolidating gains politically and diplomatically, we'll see if we can continue to so."

Cloud Nine. . .This is the type of "thinking" that got got us into the current situation. Rather than simply wave at your neighbor, you look at him through your gunsights. Follow this line of thinking through. . .

The war in Iraq has been won? Bet that's news to lots of folks.

[a warren]

The war in Iraq was won years ago. Remember that film of our hero Bush on the aircraft carrier.
Seriously though. The USA will have no credibility in the ROW until Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld etc are put before the courts for war crimes.

[D-Mack]

"In what is no doubt, not a coincidence, President Medved yesterday issued a challenge to US authority in Europe and announced new military expansion aimed at Europe. I wonder how fellow iTulipers from Europe feel about that? How will our allies in east Asia and the Mideast feel if we trade away their interests to hold off Russia. As someone on this thread mentioned Obama is a chess player, seeing several moves ahead. Well, the great game of geopolitics is exactly that, a chess game. I know a lot of people don't like the war in Iraq but in the chess game of global strategy, the US now holds a very significant strategic advantage in the mideast. The war in Iraq has been won, it is now just a matter of consolidating gains politically and diplomatically, we'll see if we can continue to so."

Cloud Nine. . .This is the type of "thinking" that got got us into the current situation. Rather than simply wave at your neighbor, you look at him through your gunsights. Follow this line of thinking through. . .

The war in Iraq has been won? Bet that's news to lots of folks.


Don't forget the author of a chess book is advising him


General Ivashov thinks the same and when I hear Biden say "It's where al Qaeda lives. It's there. It's real", I want to puke.

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[BiscayneSunrise]

Cloud Nine. . .This is the type of "thinking" that got got us into the current situation. Rather than simply wave at your neighbor, you look at him through your gunsights. Follow this line of thinking through. . .


Wish it weren't so but a brief read of world history shows otherwise. Remember the book, "The End of History" by Fukawa? He argued that after the fall of the Soviet Union, the last threat to peaceful world progress had fallen and the future of world history was to be dominated by peace and progress.




The war in Iraq has been won? Bet that's news to lots of folks.[/QUOTE]




I'm not surprised about that sentiment. If the western media wasn't so worried about being politically incorrect and had been doing their job people would recognize that the surge worked and through diplomatic and military effort. The battle is over in Iraq. It is now a matter of consolidating gains through political means.

Even the Iranians think so since they are now shifting their focus to meddling in Afghanistan.

Don't think so? When was the last time you heard of really bad news coming out of Iraq? Need more evidence? Google Kuwait Times. Their local english language newspaper. There is no one specific article but just spend some time on it to get the general sense of the geopolitics over there.